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> Only, without the oversight of a central bank.. Without the means to keep the exchange rate in check. They can't change the rate of interest or anything else.

> Only, without the oversight of a central bank.. Without the means to keep the exchange rate in check. They can't change the rate of interest or anything else. You seem to have nailed the use case well. This is exactly why'd someone use something like this. I'm not saying it's a good idea (nor a bad one), just that those things are "features" in the eyes of the cryptocurrency users and proponents, not bugs.

metalliqaz 4y ago
"for the crypto enthusiasts, the problem with the legacy financial markets wasn't that they were manipulated, it's that they weren't in on it." (reproduced here from memory)
- sunshinerag 4y ago
  “For the fiat incumbents, the problem with crypto markets is it pulls capital away from their entrenched fiat scams”
  - rchaud 4y ago
    Brian Armstrong didn't buy his $133m compound with BTC, it was from the filthy, debased USD that he exchanged his Coinbase shares for. Everyone's a fiat incumbent in the long run.
jstummbillig 4y ago
I don't know. The people I know that said "I really want my currency to have an unchecked exchange rate, that would do a lot for me" is 0. I also don't feel that's an honest representation of why anyone has gotten into btc (although I am sure some claim that's why they did it)
- capableweb 4y ago
  The one I know who actually want to use Bitcoin et al and/or work in the space (not outside "investors" who just want to earn as much money as soon as possible), don't consider the exchange rate important at all and couldn't care less about it, as Bitcoin is not for exchanging it to USD/EUR/whatever.
  - ivalm 4y ago
    But presumably they care if bitcoin is still exchangeable to something (maybe goods and services?). The exchange rate to currencies determines the exchange rate to everything else. If they don’t care about exchanging bitcoin for currencies or goods or services then what is the purpose of BTC? Both currency and store of value use cases depend on exchangability.
    - arubania2 4y ago
      There is a concept called Bitcoin maximalism that means, in my understanding, that the whole world would switch to BTC so that the exchange rates to other currencies wouldn’t matter anymore. It’s easy to get paid in BTC if you land a crypto job, but it’s the groceries part that I can’t really imagine yet.
      - ivalm 4y ago
        But even maximalists care to be able to use bitcoin to buy goods and services (eg be able to spend it). Since other currencies are also capable of being exchanged for good and services then the exchange rate to other currencies determines how much goods btc can buy (or there will be an arbitrage opportunity).
      - rchaud 4y ago
        One of the few avenues for entertainment remaining on social media are watching BTC maxis and ETH bagholders argue that the other is completely useless.
      - cecilpl2 4y ago
        https://www.investopedia.com/terms/t/trilemma.asp https://www.investopedia.com/terms/t/trilemma.asp So given the trilemma then, it sounds like Bitcoin maximalism means fixed exchange rates (since all countries use BTC), and free flow of capital (since that's the BTC ideal), which means no country can set independent monetary policy. So you essentially have the Eurozone problems but across the entire world. Seems like many countries would try to avoid picking that side of the trilemma.
- canjobear 4y ago
  Replace the statement with “I don’t want my currency’s value to be controlled by a central authority” and you’ll get >0 people.
  - yunohn 4y ago
    So… they’d rather it be controlled by rampant speculation and pumping-dumping?
    - rchaud 4y ago
      Libertarian maxis seem to think that negative externalities won't affect them personally. In lieu of an elected government and sane central bank, monetary policy will be controlled by a cartel of your locality's most powerful gangs and paramilitaries. There's a reason the example quoted is always Star Trek and not Somalia.
  - doliveira 4y ago
    There's no such thing as a power vacuum...

metalliqaz 4y ago

"for the crypto enthusiasts, the problem with the legacy financial markets wasn't that they were manipulated, it's that they weren't in on it." (reproduced here from memory)

sunshinerag 4y ago
“For the fiat incumbents, the problem with crypto markets is it pulls capital away from their entrenched fiat scams”
- rchaud 4y ago
  Brian Armstrong didn't buy his $133m compound with BTC, it was from the filthy, debased USD that he exchanged his Coinbase shares for. Everyone's a fiat incumbent in the long run.

jstummbillig 4y ago

I don't know. The people I know that said "I really want my currency to have an unchecked exchange rate, that would do a lot for me" is 0. I also don't feel that's an honest representation of why anyone has gotten into btc (although I am sure some claim that's why they did it)

capableweb 4y ago
The one I know who actually want to use Bitcoin et al and/or work in the space (not outside "investors" who just want to earn as much money as soon as possible), don't consider the exchange rate important at all and couldn't care less about it, as Bitcoin is not for exchanging it to USD/EUR/whatever.
- ivalm 4y ago
  But presumably they care if bitcoin is still exchangeable to something (maybe goods and services?). The exchange rate to currencies determines the exchange rate to everything else. If they don’t care about exchanging bitcoin for currencies or goods or services then what is the purpose of BTC? Both currency and store of value use cases depend on exchangability.
  - arubania2 4y ago
    There is a concept called Bitcoin maximalism that means, in my understanding, that the whole world would switch to BTC so that the exchange rates to other currencies wouldn’t matter anymore. It’s easy to get paid in BTC if you land a crypto job, but it’s the groceries part that I can’t really imagine yet.
    - ivalm 4y ago
      But even maximalists care to be able to use bitcoin to buy goods and services (eg be able to spend it). Since other currencies are also capable of being exchanged for good and services then the exchange rate to other currencies determines how much goods btc can buy (or there will be an arbitrage opportunity).
    - rchaud 4y ago
      One of the few avenues for entertainment remaining on social media are watching BTC maxis and ETH bagholders argue that the other is completely useless.
    - cecilpl2 4y ago
      https://www.investopedia.com/terms/t/trilemma.asp https://www.investopedia.com/terms/t/trilemma.asp So given the trilemma then, it sounds like Bitcoin maximalism means fixed exchange rates (since all countries use BTC), and free flow of capital (since that's the BTC ideal), which means no country can set independent monetary policy. So you essentially have the Eurozone problems but across the entire world. Seems like many countries would try to avoid picking that side of the trilemma.
canjobear 4y ago
Replace the statement with “I don’t want my currency’s value to be controlled by a central authority” and you’ll get >0 people.
- yunohn 4y ago
  So… they’d rather it be controlled by rampant speculation and pumping-dumping?
  - rchaud 4y ago
    Libertarian maxis seem to think that negative externalities won't affect them personally. In lieu of an elected government and sane central bank, monetary policy will be controlled by a cartel of your locality's most powerful gangs and paramilitaries. There's a reason the example quoted is always Star Trek and not Somalia.
- doliveira 4y ago
  There's no such thing as a power vacuum...