> The second argument is the one I always hear around the mathematics department: mathematics helps you to think clearly. I have a very low opinion of this self

> The second argument is the one I always hear around the mathematics department: mathematics helps you to think clearly. I have a very low opinion of this self-serving nonsense[2] Disagree. It definitely changed the way I think, and I'm no mathematician. Also calling something 'nonsense' this way is an argument smell; no justification + ad-hom = "in my opinion". Problem is, you have to be at a very high level of maths[1] and be in the right place to use that before it becomes useful, but then it becomes vital at an industry or country level. Personal opinion: change the way maths is taught. It is so appallingly taught so often, starting with abstractions and no examples, not acknowledging that so many (like me) are competent but aren't brilliant minded, and we are not abstract thinkers, so root your abstractions in the concrete to get them over. Smart people just don't understand that we don't understand. [1] I'm going to regret this, but here's me making an idiot of myself over a maths paper yesterday, just getting the wrong end of the stick massively https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31643296 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31643296 [2] Added full quote after, sorry