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I grew up at a time when people felt very strongly about Windows versus Linux. People would fight amongst themselves on Slashdot and elsewhere about whether it

I grew up at a time when people felt very strongly about Windows versus Linux. People would fight amongst themselves on Slashdot and elsewhere about whether it was OK to use Windows, or whether it was possible to do [whatever] on Linux. I guess what I'm wondering is: is OSX/iOS versus Linux/Android the operating system flame war of our time? In this thread, I see almost entirely ad hominem attacks on Stallman. (Not unlike a Daring Fireball thread in reverse.) Is he Glenn Beck or is he Rush Limbaugh? Is he just slightly impractical or is he extremely impractical? What I don't see is any substantial discussion of the OP. At the moment, there are 2/72 comments that mention the iOS App Store at all, which is a major point that Stallman seems to be making here. More generally, is no one worried about what Stallman is worried about? Jobs' explicit stated goal was to destroy the only Linux mobile platform (through patents), and his policies on the App Store and elsewhere were explicitly hostile to Free Software. Had Jobs been successful and perhaps lived another ten years, we might be living in a world with no Free Software on our personal devices at all. Apple laptops with software installed from the Mac App Store to develop iOS apps for the iOS App Store (with both App Stores of course rejecting GPL code). Given that almost all startups rely heavily on Free Software, from emacs to gcc to Xen to Ruby to every poorly constructed library on Github, that would be tremendously negative for the startup ecosystem, no?

diminish 15y ago
I - a developer who open sources some code - totally agree, it is sad that, ios app store emerged in 21st century, to control what people can use, for their own safety (and not apple's walled garden dogma); governments in oppressive countries use exact same arguments to filter internet; to protect users (children etc) against evil ... for startups, an apple-minded world would be detrimental.
ghshephard 15y ago
The irony is that Stallman can be most closely identified to the heroine in the 1984 commercial, trying to shake up people from their walled gardens of pure idiolatry. (I say this as a happy member of the iPad/iPhone/MacBook Air masses. :-)
rimantas 15y ago
> More generally, is no one worried about what Stallman is worried about? I am not. I don't even know what is Stallman worried about. Some weird definition of freedom and some weird threats to the said freedom. His ideas are outdated and misplaced: it's like rms preaches tips for survival in the desert failing to notice that dessert is no longer there and we are in the jungle. > Jobs' explicit stated goal was to destroy the only Linux mobile platform (through patents) Is Android really the only Linux based mobile platform? I highly doubt so. > and his policies on the App Store and elsewhere were explicitly hostile to Free Software. This is a blatant lie. > Had Jobs been successful and perhaps lived another ten years, we might be living in > a world with no Free Software on our personal devices at all. Another baseless speculation. How convenient to ignore reality and all the contributions Apple has done to open source. > (with both App Stores of course rejecting GPL code). But there are other licenses besides GPL which are more free ant compatible with App Store.
- deleted 15y ago
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- andylei 15y ago
  > I don't even know what is Stallman worried about. Some weird definition of freedom and some weird threats to the said freedom. His ideas are outdated and misplaced stallman's worries are not only concrete, but pretty prescient. apple sells you a computing platform where you're not allowed to install whatever software you want (if apple had its way, that would even be illegal!). that sounds pretty unfree to me. 10 years ago, i doubt that most people would have even believed that a platform like that would even be possible. the climate now is much more desert-like than ever before! > Is Android really the only Linux based mobile platform? technically, you're correct, but the fact that you can't name a single other one is telling. android is the only generally available linux based mobile platform. > This is a blatant lie. nope. the itunes store tos disallows gpl software. even further, apple has pulled apps that were licensed under the gpl.

diminish 15y ago

I - a developer who open sources some code - totally agree, it is sad that, ios app store emerged in 21st century, to control what people can use, for their own safety (and not apple's walled garden dogma); governments in oppressive countries use exact same arguments to filter internet; to protect users (children etc) against evil ... for startups, an apple-minded world would be detrimental.

ghshephard 15y ago

The irony is that Stallman can be most closely identified to the heroine in the 1984 commercial, trying to shake up people from their walled gardens of pure idiolatry. (I say this as a happy member of the iPad/iPhone/MacBook Air masses. :-)

rimantas 15y ago

> More generally, is no one worried about what Stallman is worried about? I am not. I don't even know what is Stallman worried about. Some weird definition of freedom and some weird threats to the said freedom. His ideas are outdated and misplaced: it's like rms preaches tips for survival in the desert failing to notice that dessert is no longer there and we are in the jungle. > Jobs' explicit stated goal was to destroy the only Linux mobile platform (through patents) Is Android really the only Linux based mobile platform? I highly doubt so. > and his policies on the App Store and elsewhere were explicitly hostile to Free Software. This is a blatant lie. > Had Jobs been successful and perhaps lived another ten years, we might be living in > a world with no Free Software on our personal devices at all. Another baseless speculation. How convenient to ignore reality and all the contributions Apple has done to open source. > (with both App Stores of course rejecting GPL code). But there are other licenses besides GPL which are more free ant compatible with App Store.

deleted 15y ago
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andylei 15y ago
> I don't even know what is Stallman worried about. Some weird definition of freedom and some weird threats to the said freedom. His ideas are outdated and misplaced stallman's worries are not only concrete, but pretty prescient. apple sells you a computing platform where you're not allowed to install whatever software you want (if apple had its way, that would even be illegal!). that sounds pretty unfree to me. 10 years ago, i doubt that most people would have even believed that a platform like that would even be possible. the climate now is much more desert-like than ever before! > Is Android really the only Linux based mobile platform? technically, you're correct, but the fact that you can't name a single other one is telling. android is the only generally available linux based mobile platform. > This is a blatant lie. nope. the itunes store tos disallows gpl software. even further, apple has pulled apps that were licensed under the gpl.