5 ms·

Heh, or get a Tesla. I drove from Sacramento to Reno (1100 miles or so), crossed the Sierras and the Rockies (two of the highest mountain ranges in the USA).

by sliken 4y ago

Heh, or get a Tesla. I drove from Sacramento to Reno (1100 miles or so), crossed the Sierras and the Rockies (two of the highest mountain ranges in the USA). Did no special prep related to an EV, just got in with family, pushed the listen button, and said "Navigate to Denver, Colorado". Had a dog, kid, and partner with me. Car charged at 550 miles of range per hour, when empty. Generally after everyone got out of the car, got food/snacks, stretched the legs, walked the dog for a tiny walk, etc. Usually we'd wait an extra 10-15 minutes or so for charging. The car was fast, confident at highway speeds, and has a quite nice stereo. I've never nav'd to a supercharger and not been able to charge, which seems to be a quite common experience for others. I think nearly every other review (Ford Mach-E, HD Livewire, and Zero e-motorcycle spring to mind) have charging issues during the review test. Sure it probably added an hour or so to a 17 hour trip, but that's not my normal use case. Waking up each morning with a full (actually I charge to 85% unless I'm planning a big trip) EV is nice. Not having oil changes 3-4 times a year is a bonus as well. In my experience a Tesla is a fine road trip car.

908B64B197 4y ago
Same experience here. The takeaway is that Tesla worked tirelessly into making charging (one of the major pain points of EV) as efficient and convenient as possible. And legacy manufacturers are now trying to catch up nearly a decade later (and lamentably failing). If it doesn't plug into a supercharger it's pretty much defective on arrival. https://youtu.be/hA_B7qPyUDA?t=1136 https://youtu.be/hA_B7qPyUDA?t=1136
- sliken 4y ago
  Mt Evans (about 30 minutes from my house) became famous for killing Mach-E. Apparently they didn't plan for quite that much regen. It is the highest paved road in North America. I had explored a bit, then did Mt Evans in my model 3, and was worried that I was still climbing and at 45% charge. I was amused to arrive back at my house ... with a 45% charge.
  - mensetmanusman 4y ago
    Gravity giveth and taketh, it’s fun to think about where that energy went in the meantime :)
- taylodl 4y ago
  Speaking of superchargers - I decided to look into supercharges near me (I live in a city in the U.S. midwest with a metro population just north of two million). There are 4 - in this metro region comprised of 7 counties! Four! And only two are open 24/7 every day of the week, the other two are only open on Sunday and Wednesday! Not sure why a charger would only be open two days a week, now I'm curious. I'm going to have to drive and see where these chargers are so I can better understand what's going on. Of the two that are open 24/7 - one is located somewhat conveniently close to me but is located inside a parking garage. I don't know if you'd have to pay the parking fees to use the chargers and I don't know if you'd have problems with someone parking in a spot you'd need for charging. So there's one supercharger that's open 24/7 that isn't located inside a parking garage and it has 10 chargers - to serve a population of 2 million people. Realistically what that means is anyone living in my metro area driving any EV is charging at home. They have to have their own garage. Seeing as how my city has a lot of townhomes and homes without garages that's going to hamper adoption!
taylodl 4y ago
Just checked the Tesla site. Only 2 cars new are available to me within 200 miles of my zip code: they're both 2022 model S and the one is $143,990 and the other is $149,490. That's way beyond my budget. Okay. Let's look at Tesla's used inventory. At least several cars are available, the cheapest being a 2020 Model 3 for $56,900. The last car I bought was in 2018 and it was a 2015 Honda Civic I picked up for $11,500. Now figure that I drive, at the most, 20,000 miles per year and I have a fuel efficiency of 35 MPG. That means my max fuel consumption rate is roughly 575 gallons per year. Even if gas hit ten dollars per gallon I'd still only be paying $5,750 per year in fuel. At that rate the payback for buying the cheapest Tesla available to me would be 8 years! And that's assuming gas were to jump to $10 per gallon! And that's why I haven't pulled the trigger on getting a Tesla. The value proposition simply isn't there for me. Now, if you were someone who routinely bought cars in the $30K-$50K price range then this would be a different analysis and a different discussion.
- sliken 4y ago
  Sure, Tesla's doing well, and despite an impressive production ramp supply is not meeting demand. So buying one will require getting lucky, paying top $, or preordering. I would however suggest looking at total cost to own: including not just gas, but oil changes, maintenance, and even the gas and time spent getting to/from oil/gas/maintenance. I had a 2004 Subaru Forester and was surprised how much I was spending on gas, oil changes, and maintenance. Had a head gasket go and that was pretty expensive. So far the Tesla's been just purchase price, my home electricity rate (except for $50 ish of supercharging), and costs for a second set of tires at 30k miles. Used cars do decreases costs, but if buying new the model 3 often wins comparisons on cost to own against Toyota Camry and Honda Accords.
  - bradlys 4y ago
    TCO is complicated though. If you start including other scenarios like when there is something wrong with your Tesla - you could be waiting 3+ months for the parts for your car to be fixed and it might not be useable during that time. This isn’t the same for most others.

by sliken 4y ago

908B64B197 4y ago

Same experience here. The takeaway is that Tesla worked tirelessly into making charging (one of the major pain points of EV) as efficient and convenient as possible. And legacy manufacturers are now trying to catch up nearly a decade later (and lamentably failing). If it doesn't plug into a supercharger it's pretty much defective on arrival. https://youtu.be/hA_B7qPyUDA?t=1136 https://youtu.be/hA_B7qPyUDA?t=1136

sliken 4y ago
Mt Evans (about 30 minutes from my house) became famous for killing Mach-E. Apparently they didn't plan for quite that much regen. It is the highest paved road in North America. I had explored a bit, then did Mt Evans in my model 3, and was worried that I was still climbing and at 45% charge. I was amused to arrive back at my house ... with a 45% charge.
- mensetmanusman 4y ago
  Gravity giveth and taketh, it’s fun to think about where that energy went in the meantime :)
taylodl 4y ago
Speaking of superchargers - I decided to look into supercharges near me (I live in a city in the U.S. midwest with a metro population just north of two million). There are 4 - in this metro region comprised of 7 counties! Four! And only two are open 24/7 every day of the week, the other two are only open on Sunday and Wednesday! Not sure why a charger would only be open two days a week, now I'm curious. I'm going to have to drive and see where these chargers are so I can better understand what's going on. Of the two that are open 24/7 - one is located somewhat conveniently close to me but is located inside a parking garage. I don't know if you'd have to pay the parking fees to use the chargers and I don't know if you'd have problems with someone parking in a spot you'd need for charging. So there's one supercharger that's open 24/7 that isn't located inside a parking garage and it has 10 chargers - to serve a population of 2 million people. Realistically what that means is anyone living in my metro area driving any EV is charging at home. They have to have their own garage. Seeing as how my city has a lot of townhomes and homes without garages that's going to hamper adoption!

taylodl 4y ago

Just checked the Tesla site. Only 2 cars new are available to me within 200 miles of my zip code: they're both 2022 model S and the one is $143,990 and the other is $149,490. That's way beyond my budget. Okay. Let's look at Tesla's used inventory. At least several cars are available, the cheapest being a 2020 Model 3 for $56,900. The last car I bought was in 2018 and it was a 2015 Honda Civic I picked up for $11,500. Now figure that I drive, at the most, 20,000 miles per year and I have a fuel efficiency of 35 MPG. That means my max fuel consumption rate is roughly 575 gallons per year. Even if gas hit ten dollars per gallon I'd still only be paying $5,750 per year in fuel. At that rate the payback for buying the cheapest Tesla available to me would be 8 years! And that's assuming gas were to jump to $10 per gallon! And that's why I haven't pulled the trigger on getting a Tesla. The value proposition simply isn't there for me. Now, if you were someone who routinely bought cars in the $30K-$50K price range then this would be a different analysis and a different discussion.

sliken 4y ago
Sure, Tesla's doing well, and despite an impressive production ramp supply is not meeting demand. So buying one will require getting lucky, paying top $, or preordering. I would however suggest looking at total cost to own: including not just gas, but oil changes, maintenance, and even the gas and time spent getting to/from oil/gas/maintenance. I had a 2004 Subaru Forester and was surprised how much I was spending on gas, oil changes, and maintenance. Had a head gasket go and that was pretty expensive. So far the Tesla's been just purchase price, my home electricity rate (except for $50 ish of supercharging), and costs for a second set of tires at 30k miles. Used cars do decreases costs, but if buying new the model 3 often wins comparisons on cost to own against Toyota Camry and Honda Accords.
- bradlys 4y ago
  TCO is complicated though. If you start including other scenarios like when there is something wrong with your Tesla - you could be waiting 3+ months for the parts for your car to be fixed and it might not be useable during that time. This isn’t the same for most others.