6 ms·

about https://wikileaks.org/ https://wikileaks.org/ "the site had released e-mails from the Democratic National Committee which had been stolen by hackers worki

by kome 4y ago

about https://wikileaks.org/ https://wikileaks.org/ "the site had released e-mails from the Democratic National Committee which had been stolen by hackers working on behalf of the Kremlin" is this true? i don't think there has never been a definitive evidence or proof about this. just "journalistic evidence" (= news outlets repeating the same info without any real evidence).

StanislavPetrov 4y ago
There has never been any evidence released, definitive or otherwise. The assertions have always been along the lines of, "we know Russia is capable of doing this and we know Russia would like to do this therefore Russia did this".
- wil421 4y ago
  It’s been said in various news outlets over and over again that Dutch Intelligence watched them carry out the DNR hack. Of course they aren’t going to release actual evidence. The info was released to the press much later presumably after the Dutch hack was no longer useful. See another commenters article from Ars above.
  - trasz 4y ago
    >It’s been said in various news outlets over and over again Try a little thought experiment: substitute "China" for "USA" and ask yourself, would you believe claims by Chinese espionage agency official, repeated by numerous Chinese outlets? Even if he wasn't known for committing crimes, like James Clapper is?
  - StanislavPetrov 4y ago
    >Of course they aren’t going to release actual evidence. The info was released to the press much later presumably after the Dutch hack was no longer useful. No, the "evidence" was never released. If I'm mistaken, I'd be grateful if you provided a link. If you make an assertion and claim you have secret evidence that you can't show it is exactly the same as making as assertion with no evidence.
astrange 4y ago
It was released in a “talking indictment” of some GRU hackers. You’d very rarely want to release this as it would compromise sources and methods. Due to the extreme public interest we do actually know the info came from the Dutch intelligence agency, who among other things were tapping the GRU’s security cameras.
- LMYahooTFY 4y ago
  Do you have source links for this?
  - astrange 4y ago
    No, I don’t pull up sources for comments I’m making at 7 AM because I can’t sleep.
  - shadowgovt 4y ago
    https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2018/01/dutch-intelligence-hacked-video-cameras-in-office-of-russians-who-hacked-dnc/ https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2018/01/dutch...
  - guggleet 4y ago
    Is this an attempt at a novelty account?
    - LMYahooTFY 4y ago
      Haha no, it actually didn't occur to me when asking.
  - _jal 4y ago
    This is a complicated story that's been made murkier by politics, I'm honestly not sure where the best starting place is. Marcy Wheeler is has been researching and documenting a whole cloud of related stories. These two are probably no worse than others as starting points. https://www.emptywheel.net/2017/01/04/why-was-gru-using-open-source-tools-to-hack-the-dnc/ https://www.emptywheel.net/2017/01/04/why-was-gru-using-open... https://www.emptywheel.net/2017/03/28/what-was-the-relationship-between-fsb-and-gru-in-the-dnc-hack/ https://www.emptywheel.net/2017/03/28/what-was-the-relations...
HideousKojima 4y ago
The claim that they were stolen by Russia came from James Clapper: https://time.com/4625301/cia-russia-wikileaks-dnc-hacking/ https://time.com/4625301/cia-russia-wikileaks-dnc-hacking/ You may recall Clapper from his previous film, titled "I perjured myself before Congress and lied to the American public, and I would have gotten away with it too if it weren't for that damn Snowden kid." So take anything he says with an entire truckload of salt. Edit: Source regarding his perjury - https://apnews.com/article/business-33a88feb083ea35515de3c73e3d854ad https://apnews.com/article/business-33a88feb083ea35515de3c73...
NoGravitas 4y ago
Wikileaks has always claimed that the emails were leaked to them by someone inside the DNC, not by hackers, Russian or otherwise. The claims to the contrary have essentially all come from sources related to US intelligence services, and the publicly available evidence amounts to "trust us, we're the experts". Russiagate is QAnon for liberals.

by kome 4y ago

StanislavPetrov 4y ago

There has never been any evidence released, definitive or otherwise. The assertions have always been along the lines of, "we know Russia is capable of doing this and we know Russia would like to do this therefore Russia did this".

wil421 4y ago
It’s been said in various news outlets over and over again that Dutch Intelligence watched them carry out the DNR hack. Of course they aren’t going to release actual evidence. The info was released to the press much later presumably after the Dutch hack was no longer useful. See another commenters article from Ars above.
- trasz 4y ago
  >It’s been said in various news outlets over and over again Try a little thought experiment: substitute "China" for "USA" and ask yourself, would you believe claims by Chinese espionage agency official, repeated by numerous Chinese outlets? Even if he wasn't known for committing crimes, like James Clapper is?
- StanislavPetrov 4y ago
  >Of course they aren’t going to release actual evidence. The info was released to the press much later presumably after the Dutch hack was no longer useful. No, the "evidence" was never released. If I'm mistaken, I'd be grateful if you provided a link. If you make an assertion and claim you have secret evidence that you can't show it is exactly the same as making as assertion with no evidence.

astrange 4y ago

It was released in a “talking indictment” of some GRU hackers. You’d very rarely want to release this as it would compromise sources and methods. Due to the extreme public interest we do actually know the info came from the Dutch intelligence agency, who among other things were tapping the GRU’s security cameras.

LMYahooTFY 4y ago
Do you have source links for this?
- astrange 4y ago
  No, I don’t pull up sources for comments I’m making at 7 AM because I can’t sleep.
- shadowgovt 4y ago
  https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2018/01/dutch-intelligence-hacked-video-cameras-in-office-of-russians-who-hacked-dnc/ https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2018/01/dutch...
- guggleet 4y ago
  Is this an attempt at a novelty account?
  - LMYahooTFY 4y ago
    Haha no, it actually didn't occur to me when asking.
- _jal 4y ago
  This is a complicated story that's been made murkier by politics, I'm honestly not sure where the best starting place is. Marcy Wheeler is has been researching and documenting a whole cloud of related stories. These two are probably no worse than others as starting points. https://www.emptywheel.net/2017/01/04/why-was-gru-using-open-source-tools-to-hack-the-dnc/ https://www.emptywheel.net/2017/01/04/why-was-gru-using-open... https://www.emptywheel.net/2017/03/28/what-was-the-relationship-between-fsb-and-gru-in-the-dnc-hack/ https://www.emptywheel.net/2017/03/28/what-was-the-relations...

HideousKojima 4y ago

The claim that they were stolen by Russia came from James Clapper: https://time.com/4625301/cia-russia-wikileaks-dnc-hacking/ https://time.com/4625301/cia-russia-wikileaks-dnc-hacking/ You may recall Clapper from his previous film, titled "I perjured myself before Congress and lied to the American public, and I would have gotten away with it too if it weren't for that damn Snowden kid." So take anything he says with an entire truckload of salt. Edit: Source regarding his perjury - https://apnews.com/article/business-33a88feb083ea35515de3c73e3d854ad https://apnews.com/article/business-33a88feb083ea35515de3c73...

NoGravitas 4y ago

Wikileaks has always claimed that the emails were leaked to them by someone inside the DNC, not by hackers, Russian or otherwise. The claims to the contrary have essentially all come from sources related to US intelligence services, and the publicly available evidence amounts to "trust us, we're the experts". Russiagate is QAnon for liberals.