7 ms·

I can't imagine the frame of mind wherein when i'm told that there is a way to stave off dying (a gross over-simplification of the article) -- our number one pr

by serf 4y ago

I can't imagine the frame of mind wherein when i'm told that there is a way to stave off dying (a gross over-simplification of the article) -- our number one problem for the entirety of our existence -- and I am compelled to sour the news with a reverse "I wish they were dead" statement about my political enemies. Defeating death just feels larger than human politics, it reaches into the entirety of biology unlike who The Favorite Person is at the moment.

saiya-jin 4y ago
Well then you have weak imagination. No large dictator went out willingly, all who killed tens of millions thought they are on some holy mission for greater good and just squashing the enemies of this greater good. Death is great, frees up limited resources, removes old farts who think they know how future for everybody should look like without actually having a good reason why. Lets expand reasonably at least around out solar system first (meaning say >50% of human population not on earth), and then start looming into immortality. Show me 1 truly powerful person in the past who wasnt an arrogant self centered a-hole. We talk about enslavement of whole human race potentially forever in worst possible case. If that is something you can ignore, well I can't.
- tayne 4y ago
  Show me one truly powerful person who could have survived 30% of his subjects actively resisting.
  - tablespoon 4y ago
    > Show me one truly powerful person who could have survived 30% of his subjects actively resisting. It's a lot easier for "truly powerful person" to keep "his subjects [from] actively resisting" than you seem to think.
    - tayne 4y ago
      - tablespoon 4y ago
        >>> Show me one truly powerful person who could have survived 30% of his subjects actively resisting. >> It's a lot easier for "truly powerful person" to keep "his subjects [from] actively resisting" than you seem to think. > Depends completely on the people. Not really, unless you have a fictitious people that isn't subject to social coordination problems. However, real populations are subject to those problems, which is why we've seen dynasties of awful dictators survive for generations (e.g. North Korea). The lesson of those dynasties is also probably "don't let up on the oppression or you'll lose power," which might be easier to keep up if the immortal leader doesn't doesn't have to be replaced by a naive successor. > You have a mental virus that wants to believe everything is doomed. LOL. Comments like that are totally unpersuasive, and also against the rules.
        tayne 4y ago
        Well, you do. Lots of people do. I’ve never seen one become self aware though. But anyway, no, not all people are the same. Some populations of people create, initiate, prop up and then perpetuate evil cults of dogma as is the case with North Korea. Some populations never even let it get to step one. Make no mistake, the waves of political dogma lap on every shore. It’s always ready to take over. Some populations are less inclined to group think, save the children and etc. because that’s always what fuels it. I have read a couple of books about North Korea and you can believe me that North Korea was not held at gunpoint to create the regime. I also read “nothing to envy” which is a collection of memoirs written by defectors. They absolutely do it to themselves. And the multi-generational lifespan of that regime makes your point rather moot. And Assad illustrates my point because I was watching the Syrian civil war and he very nearly did not survive. He was relegated to a bunker and when he emerged he was clearly deeply shaken and a different man. That 40 percent gave him his full moneys worth. To say that this is an example of dictators being invulnerable to dissent is incorrect. If it were 50 or 60 the scale would have tipped. It is an example of my point.
  - hedora 4y ago
    Syria is at 40% opposition, 40% pro-government, and Assad has been hanging on during an active civil war for 11 years: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syrian_opposition https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syrian_opposition
    - tayne 4y ago
      This illustrates my point
      - tablespoon 4y ago
        >>> Show me one truly powerful person who could have survived 30% of his subjects actively resisting. >> Syria is at 40% opposition, 40% pro-government, and Assad has been hanging on during an active civil war for 11 years: > This illustrates my point How so? The implication of your GGP comment was that any powerful person with that much opposition should not be able to survive, but the example shows a powerful person with more opposition surviving.
dylan604 4y ago
>there is a way to stave off dying <snip> -- our number one problem for the entirety of our existence Is it though? Who wants to live forever? Even Lestat got bored.
- justinclift 4y ago
  > Even Lestat got bored. You mean the fictional vampire character?
  - bongobingo1 4y ago
    Do you have non-fictional person who lived forever that we could reference instead?
    - hedora 4y ago
      Dick Cheney.
      - dylan604 4y ago
        I would have said Keith Richards
    - justinclift 4y ago
      My point was more that someone saying "even a vampire got bored" is less than helpful, as they're using a literally fictional character as their example. It's like saying "even the tooth fairy got bored".
firecall 4y ago
They were making a joke; sardonic humour!
FredPret 4y ago
In addition to Trump Derangement Syndrome there is also a Democrat Derangement Syndrome, and many others. Tribalistic news feeds tempt many of our brains into seeing all of life along these lines. Even food ican be political
- buu700 4y ago
  In addition to Trump Derangement Syndrome there is also a Democrat Derangement Syndrome I don't think either of these are recognized by the DSM-5.
  - zaroth 4y ago
    It predates them. Wait for v6, or maybe they’ll do a v5.1 Beta.
tuukkah 4y ago
> statement about my political enemies. Putin and Trump are not political enemies though, they are criminals. No dietary supplement can offset the premature deaths caused by Putin in Ukraine.
- worker_person 4y ago
  But somehow Biden and his son selling out the country is perfectly fine. But hey, a Bee is now considered a Fish these days. So same logic applies.
- hedora 4y ago
  Polonium could, if applied appropriately in Moscow.
- sacrosancty 4y ago
  - tuukkah 4y ago
    Wow... I'm not equally blaming the Ukrainian president as he is not equally guilty. This is a fact morally (attacking is worse than defending) as well as practically (surrendering would not stop Putin from killing). And what was Zelenskyi's crime again? Putin's is genocide.
    - TedDoesntTalk 4y ago
      > Putin's is genocide I'm not defending Putin, but how is the Ukraine war genocide? Not all wars are genocides.
      - tuukkah 4y ago
        I don't know if you're missing facts about what is happening in Ukraine, or if you don't see how those events fit the concept of genocide. In short: what is happening in Ukraine is not a normal war. Putin says his motive is to protect Russian-speakers, create a Russian empire of a single ethnicity and "undo" Ukraine as a nation. He dehumanizes Ukrainians. He removes the Ukrainian language from the areas he captures such as Donbas. He has abducted hundreds of Ukrainian children. While he "protects" Russian speakers, he commands his troops to kill Ukrainian civilians in masses. I don't know which authority you might believe as substitute of your own eyes, but here's the pope: https://www.forbes.com/sites/dereksaul/2022/05/03/pope-seeks-putin-meeting-and-compares-russian-brutality-to-rwandan-genocide/ https://www.forbes.com/sites/dereksaul/2022/05/03/pope-seeks... Here's CNN: https://edition.cnn.com/2022/05/27/europe/russia-ukraine-genocide-warning-intl/index.html https://edition.cnn.com/2022/05/27/europe/russia-ukraine-gen...

by serf 4y ago

saiya-jin 4y ago

Well then you have weak imagination. No large dictator went out willingly, all who killed tens of millions thought they are on some holy mission for greater good and just squashing the enemies of this greater good. Death is great, frees up limited resources, removes old farts who think they know how future for everybody should look like without actually having a good reason why. Lets expand reasonably at least around out solar system first (meaning say >50% of human population not on earth), and then start looming into immortality. Show me 1 truly powerful person in the past who wasnt an arrogant self centered a-hole. We talk about enslavement of whole human race potentially forever in worst possible case. If that is something you can ignore, well I can't.

tayne 4y ago
Show me one truly powerful person who could have survived 30% of his subjects actively resisting.
- tablespoon 4y ago
  > Show me one truly powerful person who could have survived 30% of his subjects actively resisting. It's a lot easier for "truly powerful person" to keep "his subjects [from] actively resisting" than you seem to think.
  - tayne 4y ago
    - tablespoon 4y ago
      >>> Show me one truly powerful person who could have survived 30% of his subjects actively resisting. >> It's a lot easier for "truly powerful person" to keep "his subjects [from] actively resisting" than you seem to think. > Depends completely on the people. Not really, unless you have a fictitious people that isn't subject to social coordination problems. However, real populations are subject to those problems, which is why we've seen dynasties of awful dictators survive for generations (e.g. North Korea). The lesson of those dynasties is also probably "don't let up on the oppression or you'll lose power," which might be easier to keep up if the immortal leader doesn't doesn't have to be replaced by a naive successor. > You have a mental virus that wants to believe everything is doomed. LOL. Comments like that are totally unpersuasive, and also against the rules.
      - tayne 4y ago
        Well, you do. Lots of people do. I’ve never seen one become self aware though. But anyway, no, not all people are the same. Some populations of people create, initiate, prop up and then perpetuate evil cults of dogma as is the case with North Korea. Some populations never even let it get to step one. Make no mistake, the waves of political dogma lap on every shore. It’s always ready to take over. Some populations are less inclined to group think, save the children and etc. because that’s always what fuels it. I have read a couple of books about North Korea and you can believe me that North Korea was not held at gunpoint to create the regime. I also read “nothing to envy” which is a collection of memoirs written by defectors. They absolutely do it to themselves. And the multi-generational lifespan of that regime makes your point rather moot. And Assad illustrates my point because I was watching the Syrian civil war and he very nearly did not survive. He was relegated to a bunker and when he emerged he was clearly deeply shaken and a different man. That 40 percent gave him his full moneys worth. To say that this is an example of dictators being invulnerable to dissent is incorrect. If it were 50 or 60 the scale would have tipped. It is an example of my point.
- hedora 4y ago
  Syria is at 40% opposition, 40% pro-government, and Assad has been hanging on during an active civil war for 11 years: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syrian_opposition https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syrian_opposition
  - tayne 4y ago
    This illustrates my point
    - tablespoon 4y ago
      >>> Show me one truly powerful person who could have survived 30% of his subjects actively resisting. >> Syria is at 40% opposition, 40% pro-government, and Assad has been hanging on during an active civil war for 11 years: > This illustrates my point How so? The implication of your GGP comment was that any powerful person with that much opposition should not be able to survive, but the example shows a powerful person with more opposition surviving.

dylan604 4y ago

>there is a way to stave off dying <snip> -- our number one problem for the entirety of our existence Is it though? Who wants to live forever? Even Lestat got bored.

justinclift 4y ago
> Even Lestat got bored. You mean the fictional vampire character?
- bongobingo1 4y ago
  Do you have non-fictional person who lived forever that we could reference instead?
  - hedora 4y ago
    Dick Cheney.
    - dylan604 4y ago
      I would have said Keith Richards
  - justinclift 4y ago
    My point was more that someone saying "even a vampire got bored" is less than helpful, as they're using a literally fictional character as their example. It's like saying "even the tooth fairy got bored".

firecall 4y ago

They were making a joke; sardonic humour!

FredPret 4y ago

In addition to Trump Derangement Syndrome there is also a Democrat Derangement Syndrome, and many others. Tribalistic news feeds tempt many of our brains into seeing all of life along these lines. Even food ican be political

buu700 4y ago
In addition to Trump Derangement Syndrome there is also a Democrat Derangement Syndrome I don't think either of these are recognized by the DSM-5.
- zaroth 4y ago
  It predates them. Wait for v6, or maybe they’ll do a v5.1 Beta.

tuukkah 4y ago

> statement about my political enemies. Putin and Trump are not political enemies though, they are criminals. No dietary supplement can offset the premature deaths caused by Putin in Ukraine.

worker_person 4y ago
But somehow Biden and his son selling out the country is perfectly fine. But hey, a Bee is now considered a Fish these days. So same logic applies.
hedora 4y ago
Polonium could, if applied appropriately in Moscow.
sacrosancty 4y ago
- tuukkah 4y ago
  Wow... I'm not equally blaming the Ukrainian president as he is not equally guilty. This is a fact morally (attacking is worse than defending) as well as practically (surrendering would not stop Putin from killing). And what was Zelenskyi's crime again? Putin's is genocide.
  - TedDoesntTalk 4y ago
    > Putin's is genocide I'm not defending Putin, but how is the Ukraine war genocide? Not all wars are genocides.
    - tuukkah 4y ago
      I don't know if you're missing facts about what is happening in Ukraine, or if you don't see how those events fit the concept of genocide. In short: what is happening in Ukraine is not a normal war. Putin says his motive is to protect Russian-speakers, create a Russian empire of a single ethnicity and "undo" Ukraine as a nation. He dehumanizes Ukrainians. He removes the Ukrainian language from the areas he captures such as Donbas. He has abducted hundreds of Ukrainian children. While he "protects" Russian speakers, he commands his troops to kill Ukrainian civilians in masses. I don't know which authority you might believe as substitute of your own eyes, but here's the pope: https://www.forbes.com/sites/dereksaul/2022/05/03/pope-seeks-putin-meeting-and-compares-russian-brutality-to-rwandan-genocide/ https://www.forbes.com/sites/dereksaul/2022/05/03/pope-seeks... Here's CNN: https://edition.cnn.com/2022/05/27/europe/russia-ukraine-genocide-warning-intl/index.html https://edition.cnn.com/2022/05/27/europe/russia-ukraine-gen...