5 ms·

Never worked at Google. Are such talks about social issues a regular occurrence at Google or other big tech firms? Who would be the intended audience and what

Never worked at Google. Are such talks about social issues a regular occurrence at Google or other big tech firms? Who would be the intended audience and what would be the goals for the speaker, the hosting employee or the host company?

civilian 4y ago
Have you not worked the last five years? Tech companies are chock full of "Diversity, Equity and Inclusion" talks
- Waterluvian 4y ago
  I have never had one in 9 years of working at tech startups. It's a fair question to ask.
  - secondcoming 4y ago
    You’re in for a treat!
  - rmbyrro 4y ago
    Startups are in survival or hyper growth mode. They don't usually have a lot of time for these topics as much as big tech.
  - jonathankoren 4y ago
    That's probably because the startup didn't have a HR department. Antibias training is super common.
    - Waterluvian 4y ago
      Both were over 300 people. Perhaps an alternative idea can be considered: this ontology people have latched onto isn’t accurate and there can be people who don’t know the above answer because indeed they aren’t exposed to a whole lot of social issue talks at work.
      - jonathankoren 4y ago
        It’s to prevent lawsuits, sweet cheeks.
- AlotOfReading 4y ago
  Having talks on academic subjects is fine. Companies should do more of that. The issue is that corporate diversity discussions happen with all the education and nuance appropriate to elementary schoolers. Because most of the people in these roles aren't actually well-educated in 'best practices', you get stuff like mandatory non-anonymized surveys that ask whether people are trans and send the results to managers, or slideshows talking about minority representation that omit Asians, Hispanics, and other 'common' groups.
- smegsicle 4y ago
  curiously, i've seen many first hand accounts of DEI stuff- but no kind of researched journalism about what's going on, why, and how widespread it is
epistasis 4y ago
These are serious social issues that affect the functioning of tech companies in the Bay Area: https://www.wired.com/story/trapped-in-silicon-valleys-hidden-caste-system/ https://www.wired.com/story/trapped-in-silicon-valleys-hidde...
- ushakov 4y ago
  funny how they cheered for diversity but completely overlooked the caste system
  - oaththrowaway 4y ago
    Because they only care about visible diversity
    - hef19898 4y ago
      Because people have a hard time getting the difference between Suunit and Shiit moslems. The caste system is even harder to grasp, for us Westerners Indians are Indians. So it seems caste based discrimination was imported through the back door, without anyone realy noticing.
      - ushakov 4y ago
        from what i’ve read here, it’s isn’t actually a hard concept to grasp it’s just that the managers are deliberately choosing to ignore the issue, because they themselves actually support (or have nothing against) casteism can’t make a diversity meeting bout that
      - secondcoming 4y ago
        > for us Westerners Indians are Indians Maybe US Westerners…
        hef19898 4y ago
        I am European, know about the caste system and won't be able to tell.
dkarl 4y ago
The article says that the speaker "has delivered presentations on caste at Microsoft, Airbnb, Netflix, Saleforce, and Adobe."
stadia42 4y ago
Yes, a regular occurrence for the social issues that are either uncontroversial (e.g., reducing poverty, improving education, dealing with pandemics) or only lightly controversial (e.g., climate change, misinformation in the media, etc.). For the more controversial topics, the talks are vetted more carefully, to make sure they align with the political position of the company, and that they don't raise too much opposition from any groups within the company. The goal of the speaker is to convert as many (preferably influential) people as possible to their viewpoint. The goal of the hosting employee is typically the same, at least for the controversial issues (since those are usually highly politicized). The goal of the host company is to promote themselves as a bastion of certain (good, from their perspective) ideas, and/or as a place for thoughtful discussions.
skybrian 4y ago
I don't know what it's like now, but in the old days, Googlers invited speakers to give "tech talks" on whatever subjects they liked. Sometimes they were only tangentially related to tech. Also, there were often authors who stopped in on their book tours. I don't think they had to be technical books at all. It was quite a fun benefit at the time, making it a bit more like college. I first learned about effective altruism when GiveWell did a tech talk. Also, in 2008, all the major presidential candidates stopped in Mountain View to give a campaign speech. And then there was the time OK Go gave a concert, due to the YouTube connection I presume. Those were different times. That was mostly before the anti-tech backlash, when Google could seemingly do no wrong. Even in the early days there were frequently minor controversies, but things got much more fraught by 2015 or so.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
wheelinsupial 4y ago
I have never worked at Google or a big tech firm, but I subscribe to and have listened to more than a few "Talks at Google." Wikipedia says this has existed since 2007. The website says, "The world's most influential thinkers, creators, makers and doers all in one place. Talks at Google. Where great minds meet." The last 5 talks in my feed: - LGBTQ & Spirituality - Neurdiversity: How to Love, Live, and Work Better - A Discussion On His Book "Jews Don't Count" - A Lookback at Japanese Internment & a Storied Writing Career - No One Understands You and What To Do About It https://talksat.withgoogle.com/ https://talksat.withgoogle.com/ I don't think I've directly answered your questions, but these talks touch on social issues, tech valuations, Mars and space exploration, physical and athletic performance, health and diet, and I guess anything else that Googlers would be interested in hearing about.
w0mbat 4y ago
The biggest controversy I remember from the old days of Google was the goji berry war. A pastry chef at a café on the Google Mountain View campus put out some nice little cakes with Tibetan goji berries. The sign said "Free Tibet Goji Berry Cake". This was obviously a sly nod to the Free Tibet campaign, and also true, as the cake was free, this being Google. Some local Chinese Googlers complained to kitchen management, saying that the idea of freeing Tibet was anti-Chinese. The pastry chef was suspended by the catering company. The story soon reached the high traffic "misc" mailing list. Many US Googlers objected to the pastry chef being punished for what they considered inoffensive free speech. A fund was started to compensate the cook for lost wages. There was a campaign to reinstate her immediately. At least one Chinese Googler threatened to quit if the cook was not fired, and was encouraged to go ahead and quit by people who sided with the cook. Some Chinese Googlers shared their interesting opinions about Tibet, e.g. they said the Dalai Lama is a Nazi, he is a secret CIA agent, etc. This new information was met with skepticism and failed to win anybody over to the Chinese side. Anyway, eventually the pastry chef was reinstated. I don't think anybody quit. It all blew over.

civilian 4y ago

Have you not worked the last five years? Tech companies are chock full of "Diversity, Equity and Inclusion" talks

Waterluvian 4y ago
I have never had one in 9 years of working at tech startups. It's a fair question to ask.
- secondcoming 4y ago
  You’re in for a treat!
- rmbyrro 4y ago
  Startups are in survival or hyper growth mode. They don't usually have a lot of time for these topics as much as big tech.
- jonathankoren 4y ago
  That's probably because the startup didn't have a HR department. Antibias training is super common.
  - Waterluvian 4y ago
    Both were over 300 people. Perhaps an alternative idea can be considered: this ontology people have latched onto isn’t accurate and there can be people who don’t know the above answer because indeed they aren’t exposed to a whole lot of social issue talks at work.
    - jonathankoren 4y ago
      It’s to prevent lawsuits, sweet cheeks.
AlotOfReading 4y ago
Having talks on academic subjects is fine. Companies should do more of that. The issue is that corporate diversity discussions happen with all the education and nuance appropriate to elementary schoolers. Because most of the people in these roles aren't actually well-educated in 'best practices', you get stuff like mandatory non-anonymized surveys that ask whether people are trans and send the results to managers, or slideshows talking about minority representation that omit Asians, Hispanics, and other 'common' groups.
smegsicle 4y ago
curiously, i've seen many first hand accounts of DEI stuff- but no kind of researched journalism about what's going on, why, and how widespread it is

epistasis 4y ago

These are serious social issues that affect the functioning of tech companies in the Bay Area: https://www.wired.com/story/trapped-in-silicon-valleys-hidden-caste-system/ https://www.wired.com/story/trapped-in-silicon-valleys-hidde...

ushakov 4y ago
funny how they cheered for diversity but completely overlooked the caste system
- oaththrowaway 4y ago
  Because they only care about visible diversity
  - hef19898 4y ago
    Because people have a hard time getting the difference between Suunit and Shiit moslems. The caste system is even harder to grasp, for us Westerners Indians are Indians. So it seems caste based discrimination was imported through the back door, without anyone realy noticing.
    - ushakov 4y ago
      from what i’ve read here, it’s isn’t actually a hard concept to grasp it’s just that the managers are deliberately choosing to ignore the issue, because they themselves actually support (or have nothing against) casteism can’t make a diversity meeting bout that
    - secondcoming 4y ago
      > for us Westerners Indians are Indians Maybe US Westerners…
      - hef19898 4y ago
        I am European, know about the caste system and won't be able to tell.

dkarl 4y ago

The article says that the speaker "has delivered presentations on caste at Microsoft, Airbnb, Netflix, Saleforce, and Adobe."

stadia42 4y ago

Yes, a regular occurrence for the social issues that are either uncontroversial (e.g., reducing poverty, improving education, dealing with pandemics) or only lightly controversial (e.g., climate change, misinformation in the media, etc.). For the more controversial topics, the talks are vetted more carefully, to make sure they align with the political position of the company, and that they don't raise too much opposition from any groups within the company. The goal of the speaker is to convert as many (preferably influential) people as possible to their viewpoint. The goal of the hosting employee is typically the same, at least for the controversial issues (since those are usually highly politicized). The goal of the host company is to promote themselves as a bastion of certain (good, from their perspective) ideas, and/or as a place for thoughtful discussions.

skybrian 4y ago

I don't know what it's like now, but in the old days, Googlers invited speakers to give "tech talks" on whatever subjects they liked. Sometimes they were only tangentially related to tech. Also, there were often authors who stopped in on their book tours. I don't think they had to be technical books at all. It was quite a fun benefit at the time, making it a bit more like college. I first learned about effective altruism when GiveWell did a tech talk. Also, in 2008, all the major presidential candidates stopped in Mountain View to give a campaign speech. And then there was the time OK Go gave a concert, due to the YouTube connection I presume. Those were different times. That was mostly before the anti-tech backlash, when Google could seemingly do no wrong. Even in the early days there were frequently minor controversies, but things got much more fraught by 2015 or so.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

wheelinsupial 4y ago

I have never worked at Google or a big tech firm, but I subscribe to and have listened to more than a few "Talks at Google." Wikipedia says this has existed since 2007. The website says, "The world's most influential thinkers, creators, makers and doers all in one place. Talks at Google. Where great minds meet." The last 5 talks in my feed: - LGBTQ & Spirituality - Neurdiversity: How to Love, Live, and Work Better - A Discussion On His Book "Jews Don't Count" - A Lookback at Japanese Internment & a Storied Writing Career - No One Understands You and What To Do About It https://talksat.withgoogle.com/ https://talksat.withgoogle.com/ I don't think I've directly answered your questions, but these talks touch on social issues, tech valuations, Mars and space exploration, physical and athletic performance, health and diet, and I guess anything else that Googlers would be interested in hearing about.

w0mbat 4y ago

The biggest controversy I remember from the old days of Google was the goji berry war. A pastry chef at a café on the Google Mountain View campus put out some nice little cakes with Tibetan goji berries. The sign said "Free Tibet Goji Berry Cake". This was obviously a sly nod to the Free Tibet campaign, and also true, as the cake was free, this being Google. Some local Chinese Googlers complained to kitchen management, saying that the idea of freeing Tibet was anti-Chinese. The pastry chef was suspended by the catering company. The story soon reached the high traffic "misc" mailing list. Many US Googlers objected to the pastry chef being punished for what they considered inoffensive free speech. A fund was started to compensate the cook for lost wages. There was a campaign to reinstate her immediately. At least one Chinese Googler threatened to quit if the cook was not fired, and was encouraged to go ahead and quit by people who sided with the cook. Some Chinese Googlers shared their interesting opinions about Tibet, e.g. they said the Dalai Lama is a Nazi, he is a secret CIA agent, etc. This new information was met with skepticism and failed to win anybody over to the Chinese side. Anyway, eventually the pastry chef was reinstated. I don't think anybody quit. It all blew over.