5 ms·

Wrong, I wear the thread the same reason a Sikh wears a turban or a Muslim woman wears a niqab/burka. Wearing a sacred thread has about as much relation to cond

by rajup 4y ago

Wrong, I wear the thread the same reason a Sikh wears a turban or a Muslim woman wears a niqab/burka. Wearing a sacred thread has about as much relation to condoning/accepting caste discrimination as wearing a niqab has to terrorism, but these kinds of bigoted ignorant comments are exactly why Google was right in not allowing the talk to happen.

whimsicalism 4y ago
Reverse caste-ism
- rajup 4y ago
  We seem to be on the path to it for sure :)
bongoman37 4y ago
[dead]
senthil_rajasek 4y ago
The sacred thread is exclusive to Brahmins and a distinct caste marker. Non-Brahmin Hindus are not allowed to wear the sacred thread. Turbans and burqa do not have such intra-religious restriction. Comparing the sacred thread to turbans/ burqas is a false comparison.
- rajup 4y ago
  Many Brahmins I know don’t wear it. So how is it a caste marker? Heck I wear it only during certain ceremonies. So the point the gp was making about people wearing the sacred thread condoning the caste system and discrimination is patently false and bigoted.
  - senthil_rajasek 4y ago
    >Many Brahmins I know don’t wear it. But only Brahmins have the right to wear it. Wearing a "sacred thread" in a society that wants to eliminate caste based discrimination is promoting and condoning discrimination. As an extreme example, how is this different from a klan member choosing to wear a "hood" in public.
    - handoflixue 4y ago
      Only members of the KKK wear a hood, and all members of the KKK tautologically support racism. Presumably it is possible to be Brahmin, without supporting caste discrimination. A better analogy would be: Do you feel it should be illegal to mention have a degree from Yale or Harvard? They're both markers of status, and people absolutely discriminate based on that, but I don't think "I have a degree from Harvard" automatically makes you complicit in that.
      - senthil_rajasek 4y ago
        Calling oneself by a caste name such as a Brahmin is "casteist", it's tautological. A college degree is earned, a Brahmin caste status is inherited much like the klan claiming supreme status by blood.
        rajup 4y ago
        Well, most religions are inherited and (as of today at least) identifying as religious does not automatically make one <insert-favorite-identity>-ist.
        senthil_rajasek 4y ago
        Most religions allow conversions but you can never convert into a Brahmin. It's only inherited.
        devnonymous 4y ago
        How did religion enter the conversation? Are you saying that you'd stop being a Hindu if you give up your Brahmin identity?
  - india_usa 4y ago
    veda vyas and valmiki were not brahmin by birth by became through their actions
    - senthil_rajasek 4y ago
      This is mythology. What we need is a system based on laws with checks and balances that ensures the poor and the marginalized get their fair shake?
- xadhix 4y ago
  Wanted to correct one part of what you said: The thread is not exclusive to Brahmins[1] I know people who identify as Kshatriyas and Vaisyas wear it. It is just that almost all brahmins do it and the practice has reduced or stopped in the other two varnas. And from what I see, he didn't compare the thread to burqas. He compared the calling of the thread as sign of discrimination to calling the turban as a sign of terrorism. There is a difference. [1] https://www.firstpost.com/india/hinduism-denies-spiritual-rights-to-shudras-dalits-and-adivasis-6070321.html https://www.firstpost.com/india/hinduism-denies-spiritual-ri...
  - senthil_rajasek 4y ago
    OP said, "I wear the thread the same reason a Sikh wears a turban or a Muslim woman wears a niqab/burka." That's the comparison. >know people who identify as Kshatriyas and Vaisyas wear it I know but all Brahmins wear the sacred thread.
    - rajup 4y ago
      > I know but all Brahmins wear the sacred thread. False. I may have only anecdotal evidence, but even one counter-example renders your statement incorrect.
ordu 4y ago
> I wear the thread the same reason It doesn't matter what reasons you have. What matters is the consequence of your behavior, namely, it is visible difference between castes, which makes discrimination easier and avoiding discrimination harder. All previous fights against discrimination shared one phenomenon: priveledged start to whine that they are reverse-discriminated. And at some point they probably are discriminated against. But the funny thing, that without their cooperation in a fight against discrimination there are no other way to win but to discriminate in reverse. And your comment show that you are not concerned in a slightest about discrimination. Tradition is more important to you than people.
- rajup 4y ago
  > It doesn't matter what reasons you have. What matters is the consequence of your behavior, namely, it is visible difference between castes, which makes discrimination easier and avoiding discrimination harder. Not unless I go running around naked > And your comment show that you are not concerned in a slightest about discrimination. Tradition is more important to you than people. How exactly do you infer that? You don’t know me. I care about discrimination just as much as the next person. What I don’t care much for is rank identity politics disguised as benevolent activism spewed from a non-existent moral high ground.
  - ordu 4y ago
    > How exactly do you infer that? 1. You show that you care about tradition. And you show not a slightest attempt to care about people. Words reflect mind. Not perfectly, but there is one more consideration: 2. I heard a lot from privileged. I said some of that talk myself, and I know how mind must work to say it. I changed myself and rejected my priviledge, my mind works in different ways. I do not belive my reasons to do something anymore, I have found then the only sensible way to judge my inclination to discriminate is to assess my actions and their consequences. In my previous conment I applied the technique to your actions as you described them. It is possible that you lied, but I believe it is unlikely. > What I don’t care much for is rank identity politics disguised as benevolent activism spewed from a non-existent moral high ground. You are angry, Jupiter, therefore you are wrong. When you switch to an emotional talk, it seems to me to be an additional bit of evidence, that you are lying to yourself about how you care about people and discrimination. It is a very predictable reaction.
india_usa 4y ago

by rajup 4y ago

whimsicalism 4y ago

Reverse caste-ism

rajup 4y ago
We seem to be on the path to it for sure :)

bongoman37 4y ago

[dead]

senthil_rajasek 4y ago

The sacred thread is exclusive to Brahmins and a distinct caste marker. Non-Brahmin Hindus are not allowed to wear the sacred thread. Turbans and burqa do not have such intra-religious restriction. Comparing the sacred thread to turbans/ burqas is a false comparison.

rajup 4y ago
Many Brahmins I know don’t wear it. So how is it a caste marker? Heck I wear it only during certain ceremonies. So the point the gp was making about people wearing the sacred thread condoning the caste system and discrimination is patently false and bigoted.
- senthil_rajasek 4y ago
  >Many Brahmins I know don’t wear it. But only Brahmins have the right to wear it. Wearing a "sacred thread" in a society that wants to eliminate caste based discrimination is promoting and condoning discrimination. As an extreme example, how is this different from a klan member choosing to wear a "hood" in public.
  - handoflixue 4y ago
    Only members of the KKK wear a hood, and all members of the KKK tautologically support racism. Presumably it is possible to be Brahmin, without supporting caste discrimination. A better analogy would be: Do you feel it should be illegal to mention have a degree from Yale or Harvard? They're both markers of status, and people absolutely discriminate based on that, but I don't think "I have a degree from Harvard" automatically makes you complicit in that.
    - senthil_rajasek 4y ago
      Calling oneself by a caste name such as a Brahmin is "casteist", it's tautological. A college degree is earned, a Brahmin caste status is inherited much like the klan claiming supreme status by blood.
      - rajup 4y ago
        Well, most religions are inherited and (as of today at least) identifying as religious does not automatically make one <insert-favorite-identity>-ist.
        senthil_rajasek 4y ago
        Most religions allow conversions but you can never convert into a Brahmin. It's only inherited.
        devnonymous 4y ago
        How did religion enter the conversation? Are you saying that you'd stop being a Hindu if you give up your Brahmin identity?
- india_usa 4y ago
  veda vyas and valmiki were not brahmin by birth by became through their actions
  - senthil_rajasek 4y ago
    This is mythology. What we need is a system based on laws with checks and balances that ensures the poor and the marginalized get their fair shake?
xadhix 4y ago
Wanted to correct one part of what you said: The thread is not exclusive to Brahmins[1] I know people who identify as Kshatriyas and Vaisyas wear it. It is just that almost all brahmins do it and the practice has reduced or stopped in the other two varnas. And from what I see, he didn't compare the thread to burqas. He compared the calling of the thread as sign of discrimination to calling the turban as a sign of terrorism. There is a difference. [1] https://www.firstpost.com/india/hinduism-denies-spiritual-rights-to-shudras-dalits-and-adivasis-6070321.html https://www.firstpost.com/india/hinduism-denies-spiritual-ri...
- senthil_rajasek 4y ago
  OP said, "I wear the thread the same reason a Sikh wears a turban or a Muslim woman wears a niqab/burka." That's the comparison. >know people who identify as Kshatriyas and Vaisyas wear it I know but all Brahmins wear the sacred thread.
  - rajup 4y ago
    > I know but all Brahmins wear the sacred thread. False. I may have only anecdotal evidence, but even one counter-example renders your statement incorrect.

ordu 4y ago

> I wear the thread the same reason It doesn't matter what reasons you have. What matters is the consequence of your behavior, namely, it is visible difference between castes, which makes discrimination easier and avoiding discrimination harder. All previous fights against discrimination shared one phenomenon: priveledged start to whine that they are reverse-discriminated. And at some point they probably are discriminated against. But the funny thing, that without their cooperation in a fight against discrimination there are no other way to win but to discriminate in reverse. And your comment show that you are not concerned in a slightest about discrimination. Tradition is more important to you than people.

rajup 4y ago
> It doesn't matter what reasons you have. What matters is the consequence of your behavior, namely, it is visible difference between castes, which makes discrimination easier and avoiding discrimination harder. Not unless I go running around naked > And your comment show that you are not concerned in a slightest about discrimination. Tradition is more important to you than people. How exactly do you infer that? You don’t know me. I care about discrimination just as much as the next person. What I don’t care much for is rank identity politics disguised as benevolent activism spewed from a non-existent moral high ground.
- ordu 4y ago
  > How exactly do you infer that? 1. You show that you care about tradition. And you show not a slightest attempt to care about people. Words reflect mind. Not perfectly, but there is one more consideration: 2. I heard a lot from privileged. I said some of that talk myself, and I know how mind must work to say it. I changed myself and rejected my priviledge, my mind works in different ways. I do not belive my reasons to do something anymore, I have found then the only sensible way to judge my inclination to discriminate is to assess my actions and their consequences. In my previous conment I applied the technique to your actions as you described them. It is possible that you lied, but I believe it is unlikely. > What I don’t care much for is rank identity politics disguised as benevolent activism spewed from a non-existent moral high ground. You are angry, Jupiter, therefore you are wrong. When you switch to an emotional talk, it seems to me to be an additional bit of evidence, that you are lying to yourself about how you care about people and discrimination. It is a very predictable reaction.

india_usa 4y ago