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It's not equal. The end game for many progressives is things like Mao China. Where millions died due to bad polices. Also Venezuela, USSR, etc. Conservatives

It's not equal. The end game for many progressives is things like Mao China. Where millions died due to bad polices. Also Venezuela, USSR, etc. Conservatives mostly want to avoid that path, or things that take us down that path.

rfrey 4y ago
The end game for many progressives is policies commonplace in every other western nation, not duplication of authoritarian atrocities.
- TMWNN 4y ago
  Yes, I too favor * Privatized postal services * Zero governmental services/benefits for illegal aliens (certainly no driver's licenses or working papers) * Point-based immigration policies, as opposed to family reunification and "diversity" visas * No "affirmative action" programs * Significantly stricter abortion windows than what Roe v. Wade imposed nationwide in the US
wolverine876 4y ago
> The end game for many progressives is things like Mao China. Doesn't that smack of demonization to you? It has nothing to do with progressivism, any more than all doctors lead to Joseph Mengele. Get out there and read some progressive things; go to the source; stop reading what others say about progressive ideas. It's nothing at all like what you imagine; progressive people are primarly just people, with common sense and opinions, like you.
dragonwriter 4y ago
> The end game for many progressives is things like Mao China. This is less true then “the end game for many conservatives is things like Nazi Germany”; sure, Maoists (and, if one takes “like” that somewhat more broadly, Leninist and other authoritarian Communists) exist, but even among the radical Left they are outnumbered by Anarchists, Libertarian Socialists, and other anti-authoritarians, and the whole of the radical Left is outnumbered by DemSocs and SocDems within the “progressive” space (really, the radical Left and progressives both generally view themselves as different groups, but I suspect “progressive” is being used more broadly as “people to the left of the center of the Democratic Party”.) OTOH, fairly overt authoritarian White Nationalists/Supremacists (and overlapping but not identical authoritarian theocrats) make up a lot bigger share of the local right (Republican and further right) than authoritarian Communists do of the local left (Democratic and further left.) But, while we should not ignore the dangerous agenda of certain extremists of either side, and while extremists actions may occasionally merit a particular focussed response, it doesn't really make sense to judge either side by its radical fringe alone.
cheriot 4y ago
I know a lot of progressives and I've not met one that idolizes Mao's China, Venezuela, or the USSR. When other countries are brought up as examples to learn from it's Nordic countries and other industrialized, capitalist democracies.

rfrey 4y ago

The end game for many progressives is policies commonplace in every other western nation, not duplication of authoritarian atrocities.

TMWNN 4y ago
Yes, I too favor * Privatized postal services * Zero governmental services/benefits for illegal aliens (certainly no driver's licenses or working papers) * Point-based immigration policies, as opposed to family reunification and "diversity" visas * No "affirmative action" programs * Significantly stricter abortion windows than what Roe v. Wade imposed nationwide in the US

wolverine876 4y ago

> The end game for many progressives is things like Mao China. Doesn't that smack of demonization to you? It has nothing to do with progressivism, any more than all doctors lead to Joseph Mengele. Get out there and read some progressive things; go to the source; stop reading what others say about progressive ideas. It's nothing at all like what you imagine; progressive people are primarly just people, with common sense and opinions, like you.

dragonwriter 4y ago

> The end game for many progressives is things like Mao China. This is less true then “the end game for many conservatives is things like Nazi Germany”; sure, Maoists (and, if one takes “like” that somewhat more broadly, Leninist and other authoritarian Communists) exist, but even among the radical Left they are outnumbered by Anarchists, Libertarian Socialists, and other anti-authoritarians, and the whole of the radical Left is outnumbered by DemSocs and SocDems within the “progressive” space (really, the radical Left and progressives both generally view themselves as different groups, but I suspect “progressive” is being used more broadly as “people to the left of the center of the Democratic Party”.) OTOH, fairly overt authoritarian White Nationalists/Supremacists (and overlapping but not identical authoritarian theocrats) make up a lot bigger share of the local right (Republican and further right) than authoritarian Communists do of the local left (Democratic and further left.) But, while we should not ignore the dangerous agenda of certain extremists of either side, and while extremists actions may occasionally merit a particular focussed response, it doesn't really make sense to judge either side by its radical fringe alone.

cheriot 4y ago

I know a lot of progressives and I've not met one that idolizes Mao's China, Venezuela, or the USSR. When other countries are brought up as examples to learn from it's Nordic countries and other industrialized, capitalist democracies.