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You find these earth cellars in many places across Europe, even today. Often they're built into hillsides. Also, in Europe many old houses still have similar ce

You find these earth cellars in many places across Europe, even today. Often they're built into hillsides. Also, in Europe many old houses still have similar cellars without artificial flooring, which tend to be much better for preserving food. My grandma would e.g. fill up an entire room in her cellar with apples in autumn and they would keep well (apart from slightly shriveling) for an entire year.

usrusr 4y ago
And bonus points if you have a creek uphill that you can divert to the top of a vertical chute in your tunnel system to send it over a drip-grid when temperatures are slightly freezing: not too cold to have the creek still running, but cold enough make the water form icicles from the drip grid. Pass by once a day to kick down newly formed icicles, building an ice reservoir at the bottom of the chute. I know a brewery that solves all their cooling needs with this method. (no idea if they reinstated that system in the oughts, when starting to advertise as "all renewable", or if they just failed to update to electric refrigeration long enough that it eventually became fashionable again - hardly more than a century of "yeah, perhaps next year, I'm busy!")
- RicoElectrico 4y ago
  Sounds interesting, but I'm not sure if I understood correctly. Can you provide an illustration?
  - usrusr 4y ago
    Edit: yeah, totally the wrong thread, sorry. Implementation of the icicle thing is really simple, divert the creek (or parts of it) onto a wooden contraption that would split it into many small trickle-streams. Trickle streams small enough to make them freeze into icicles. Occasionally, take some plank or pole to bang the icicles off the wooden contraption, this needs to be done before they grow so heavy they overload the frame. Have a cellar/chute deep enough to not fill up to the top in of winter. Do a Google image search for eisgalgen (none of the examples are from a natural stream and also no directly above the chute implementations) (original reply) In Excel, a cell with a formula has two faces, the formula and the result. An implementation of "plain csv, but with a way to run formulas" could simply branch out to using separate files, particularly if you already have an a UI that's good at working with more than one file. Technically, the additional input file would be unnecessary, because all input data could all be in the formula file, with some shorthand for "identity transformation". (still original wrong thread reply, nothing new below) The more I think about it, the "hashbang part" could even be designed to work as an actual script, sending the file (or files) to an interpreter that produces the result stream to stdout. Add an interface for doing cell by cell interactive updates and you'd have full independence between the implementations of UI and formula syntax.
    - the_third_wave 4y ago
      Posted in the wrong thread, I assume? The relation between Excel cells and beer-cooling icicles is tenuous at best.
      - usrusr 4y ago
        Thanks, now my mind is going through a what-if where Clippy is educating us about natural all-year beer cooling techniques!
      - dotancohen 4y ago
        You've never had an Excel formula freeze the computer?
        the_third_wave 4y ago
        Only when it involves large amounts of negative numbers.
    - ggambetta 4y ago
christophilus 4y ago
You find them in old houses in the US, too. They’re called “root cellars”, and generally have dirt floors with brick walls. They do work surprisingly well. I live in a hot part of the US, and those cellars are like heaven in the summer.
_ph_ 4y ago
Indeed. In Cologne, which has quite a beer-brewing tradition, there are even humongous deep and large cellars, where they stored ice and cooled the beer barrels for later sale. Some of them are as large as a basketball court and today they make nice party locations - there is no way the sound gets to the surface, so you can make any noise without aggravating neighbors :)
loeg 4y ago
We keep apples at room temp for up to a year in our house, too — no basement/cellar. They just keep really well. (Seattle.)
dontbenebby 4y ago
>You find these earth cellars in many places across Europe, even today. Weren't these the original "wine cellars"? :-)
MisterBastahrd 4y ago
My great grandfather did the same thing with potatoes, sweet potatoes, and cabbages in Louisiana. He would plant enough of both for a year and keep them in a dug-in shed with a soil floor. I'll never forget the smell of the soil coming off of the veggies as we pulled them out for eating.

usrusr 4y ago

And bonus points if you have a creek uphill that you can divert to the top of a vertical chute in your tunnel system to send it over a drip-grid when temperatures are slightly freezing: not too cold to have the creek still running, but cold enough make the water form icicles from the drip grid. Pass by once a day to kick down newly formed icicles, building an ice reservoir at the bottom of the chute. I know a brewery that solves all their cooling needs with this method. (no idea if they reinstated that system in the oughts, when starting to advertise as "all renewable", or if they just failed to update to electric refrigeration long enough that it eventually became fashionable again - hardly more than a century of "yeah, perhaps next year, I'm busy!")

RicoElectrico 4y ago
Sounds interesting, but I'm not sure if I understood correctly. Can you provide an illustration?
- usrusr 4y ago
  Edit: yeah, totally the wrong thread, sorry. Implementation of the icicle thing is really simple, divert the creek (or parts of it) onto a wooden contraption that would split it into many small trickle-streams. Trickle streams small enough to make them freeze into icicles. Occasionally, take some plank or pole to bang the icicles off the wooden contraption, this needs to be done before they grow so heavy they overload the frame. Have a cellar/chute deep enough to not fill up to the top in of winter. Do a Google image search for eisgalgen (none of the examples are from a natural stream and also no directly above the chute implementations) (original reply) In Excel, a cell with a formula has two faces, the formula and the result. An implementation of "plain csv, but with a way to run formulas" could simply branch out to using separate files, particularly if you already have an a UI that's good at working with more than one file. Technically, the additional input file would be unnecessary, because all input data could all be in the formula file, with some shorthand for "identity transformation". (still original wrong thread reply, nothing new below) The more I think about it, the "hashbang part" could even be designed to work as an actual script, sending the file (or files) to an interpreter that produces the result stream to stdout. Add an interface for doing cell by cell interactive updates and you'd have full independence between the implementations of UI and formula syntax.
  - the_third_wave 4y ago
    Posted in the wrong thread, I assume? The relation between Excel cells and beer-cooling icicles is tenuous at best.
    - usrusr 4y ago
      Thanks, now my mind is going through a what-if where Clippy is educating us about natural all-year beer cooling techniques!
    - dotancohen 4y ago
      You've never had an Excel formula freeze the computer?
      - the_third_wave 4y ago
        Only when it involves large amounts of negative numbers.
  - ggambetta 4y ago

christophilus 4y ago

You find them in old houses in the US, too. They’re called “root cellars”, and generally have dirt floors with brick walls. They do work surprisingly well. I live in a hot part of the US, and those cellars are like heaven in the summer.

_ph_ 4y ago

Indeed. In Cologne, which has quite a beer-brewing tradition, there are even humongous deep and large cellars, where they stored ice and cooled the beer barrels for later sale. Some of them are as large as a basketball court and today they make nice party locations - there is no way the sound gets to the surface, so you can make any noise without aggravating neighbors :)

loeg 4y ago

We keep apples at room temp for up to a year in our house, too — no basement/cellar. They just keep really well. (Seattle.)

dontbenebby 4y ago

>You find these earth cellars in many places across Europe, even today. Weren't these the original "wine cellars"? :-)

MisterBastahrd 4y ago

My great grandfather did the same thing with potatoes, sweet potatoes, and cabbages in Louisiana. He would plant enough of both for a year and keep them in a dug-in shed with a soil floor. I'll never forget the smell of the soil coming off of the veggies as we pulled them out for eating.