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Foreigners in Japan have the same issue. Pretend not to speak a lick of Japanese and you'll get great service. Speak just a little and suddenly they think you c

Foreigners in Japan have the same issue. Pretend not to speak a lick of Japanese and you'll get great service. Speak just a little and suddenly they think you can read Archimedes (or the Japanese equivalent).

marban 4y ago
They're also aware how difficult it is to learn so you get the extra props for trying. My wife learned Japanese to full professional proficiency and we basically get the extra acknowledgment all the time.
null_object 4y ago
> Pretend not to speak a lick of Japanese and you'll get great service. Same here in Sweden: I look South European, so if I speak Swedish I'm just a 'foreigner', if I speak English I'm a tourist who should be impressed by how welcoming and friendly the locals are.
- wasmitnetzen 4y ago
  As a German in Sweden, asking "Do you speak English?" in Swedish works very rarely. Apparently my accent isn't bad enough. I'm now usually asking "Can we speak English with each other?" (in Swedish) which I find a bit more rude, but works a lot better.
  - telesilla 4y ago
    I do the same, it works the world over. Especially if you go the extra mile to learn to say "I am learning, but your language is challenging and I know you will have a better command of English" which serves to flatter and gets you great service.
- deleted 4y ago
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bitwize 4y ago
My experience was the opposite. Pretend to speak no Japanese and you will get baffled looks and maybe asked to leave the store. At best you will be treated a little coldly. Speak a little and they will be most accommodating. They will help you fill in the gaps of your language knowledge and do their best to make your experience in Japan smoother. Overall, Japanese people really are culturally and linguistically fairly isolated on their little island chain -- and they hate it. One of the upshots of this is that fluent or even conversational English speakers are quite rare in Japan; and another is that anything and anyone from "overseas" is a potential source of fascination and wonder. (A little scary, too.) So when it comes particularly to the young (< 50 y.o. give or take), as a foreign tourist you will find yourself surrounded by people mildly to extremely intrigued in making a cross-cultural connection -- seeking a "borderless feeling" -- but they have no idea how. With a bit of conversational Japanese, you can establish lines of communication with the Japanese you meet and kick off that connection process, for which they will be quite grateful. At the very least, learn how to ask for an English speaker if one is available. I did this once in a frozen yogurt shop, and was introduced to the manager, a 22-year-old who wanted to tell me all about her time as an exchange student in California (as well as how to buy yogurt in the shop). Of course, this was Osaka. So maybe they were just super-accommodating to me so they would get my business. (By comparison to Tokyo, Osaka is hustle town -- matters of decorum and cultural appropriateness can be put aside if it means more business.)
- LAC-Tech 4y ago
  Of course, this was Osaka. So maybe they were just super-accommodating to me so they would get my business. (By comparison to Tokyo, Osaka is hustle town -- matters of decorum and cultural appropriateness can be put aside if it means more business.) LOL this is my experience in Taiwan. I find my Mandarin is miraculously much better at the night markets than it is when asking directions. Honestly I love being a poor mandarin speaker in Taiwan. I am pretty sure a good chunk of the population has better english than my mando, but if I start with madarin they will respond in kind 90% of the time. My theory is that they're happy for me to struggle with a language than to do the same themselves - fine by me, great opportunity to practice!
  - 4y ago
wccrawford 4y ago
My wife and I went to Tokyo, and it stayed in a hotel by Disney. We spent like 4-5 days in Tokyo itself, and another 4-5 at the Disney parks. My experience, everywhere in Tokyo from small restaurants to Disney, was that everyone was nervous to try to speak English with me, but willing to try. Even the waitress at one restaurant that clearly didn't speak much English. When I tried to speak Japanese, they were delighted. My language partners have highly praised my accent, which I understand to mean that I'm not completely horrible. And I have a decent basic vocabulary and horrible grammar. I have had some instances (both in Tokyo and with my language partners who were not in Tokyo) where they suddenly started talking way above my level, and I had to ask them to explain things, but I think that's just the weirdness of talking to a full grown adult that speaks like a child, and trying to manage that situation.
- imadethis 4y ago
  The 日本語上手ですね！ (lit. your Japanese is good) phenomenon. You know you’ve made it when your Japanese stops getting complimented. Obligatory Dogen: https://youtu.be/Qmfipv-H4_o https://youtu.be/Qmfipv-H4_o
  - senko 4y ago
    I believe this is true for most languages. I've had the same happen (and then stop happening, to my delight) to me with English (non-native speaker with fairly strong Eastern European accent).
    - throwawaymaths 4y ago
      Except french (in Paris and Quebec -- some other parts of France do this IME, no clue about the rest of the francophone world)
      - loufe 4y ago
        What do you mean to say here?
  - 4y ago
dpifke 4y ago
I got really frustrated the first time I spent an extended period of time in Germany, and was trying to learn German. Every time I tried to practice the language, native speakers would immediately switch to English. I assumed this was because my German sucked. Someone finally explained to me that my beginner German was fine, but most people relished the opportunity to practice their English. I learned to just keep going in broken German, my conversation partner in broken English. For the most part, it worked.
- TomK32 4y ago
  As a German it took me quite some practice to get over this nicety and stick to German when talking with a foreigner who's bad at German but knows decent English.
- t_mann 4y ago
  There might be something else at play too - it's probably harder for them to remind themselves to slow down / speak in a sufficiently 'textbook-like' style in their own language than it is for them to switch to English.
- Maultasche 4y ago
  I had the same experience when I was doing an internship in Germany. One particular coworker kept speaking English to me, despite everyone else speaking German to me. At this point, I had lived there for a year already and spoke German pretty well, so comprehension definitely wasn't an issue. I think he was either used to speaking English with non-Germans or just liked having the opportunity to speak English. I just kept replying in German and he eventually switched to speaking German to me.
- theturtle32 4y ago
  I'm trying in earnest to learn Spanish, and am at intermediate level. I've had similar experiences trying to use Spanish in various contexts particularly in Southern California where I live, where there are a ton of native Spanish speakers that also speak English, and most of them speak FAR better English than I speak Spanish. Years into my language-learning adventure, I continue to feel super intimidated to try to use my Spanish here, locally, because people so often compliment my accent but the conversation quickly switches to English. I always feel like I'm creating frustration and inconvenience by trying to practice my Spanish, though it could just be my nervousness and desire to people-please that lead me to feel that way. I've had more of this kind of experience (Me speaking intermediate Spanish, with my conversation partner speaking intermediate English) in places outside of my home area where people are more likely to speak Spanish than English on a regular basis: a range of Latin American countries that I've visited, and especially when I visited the U.S. territory of Puerto Rico.

marban 4y ago

They're also aware how difficult it is to learn so you get the extra props for trying. My wife learned Japanese to full professional proficiency and we basically get the extra acknowledgment all the time.

null_object 4y ago

> Pretend not to speak a lick of Japanese and you'll get great service. Same here in Sweden: I look South European, so if I speak Swedish I'm just a 'foreigner', if I speak English I'm a tourist who should be impressed by how welcoming and friendly the locals are.

wasmitnetzen 4y ago
As a German in Sweden, asking "Do you speak English?" in Swedish works very rarely. Apparently my accent isn't bad enough. I'm now usually asking "Can we speak English with each other?" (in Swedish) which I find a bit more rude, but works a lot better.
- telesilla 4y ago
  I do the same, it works the world over. Especially if you go the extra mile to learn to say "I am learning, but your language is challenging and I know you will have a better command of English" which serves to flatter and gets you great service.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]

bitwize 4y ago

My experience was the opposite. Pretend to speak no Japanese and you will get baffled looks and maybe asked to leave the store. At best you will be treated a little coldly. Speak a little and they will be most accommodating. They will help you fill in the gaps of your language knowledge and do their best to make your experience in Japan smoother. Overall, Japanese people really are culturally and linguistically fairly isolated on their little island chain -- and they hate it. One of the upshots of this is that fluent or even conversational English speakers are quite rare in Japan; and another is that anything and anyone from "overseas" is a potential source of fascination and wonder. (A little scary, too.) So when it comes particularly to the young (< 50 y.o. give or take), as a foreign tourist you will find yourself surrounded by people mildly to extremely intrigued in making a cross-cultural connection -- seeking a "borderless feeling" -- but they have no idea how. With a bit of conversational Japanese, you can establish lines of communication with the Japanese you meet and kick off that connection process, for which they will be quite grateful. At the very least, learn how to ask for an English speaker if one is available. I did this once in a frozen yogurt shop, and was introduced to the manager, a 22-year-old who wanted to tell me all about her time as an exchange student in California (as well as how to buy yogurt in the shop). Of course, this was Osaka. So maybe they were just super-accommodating to me so they would get my business. (By comparison to Tokyo, Osaka is hustle town -- matters of decorum and cultural appropriateness can be put aside if it means more business.)

LAC-Tech 4y ago
Of course, this was Osaka. So maybe they were just super-accommodating to me so they would get my business. (By comparison to Tokyo, Osaka is hustle town -- matters of decorum and cultural appropriateness can be put aside if it means more business.) LOL this is my experience in Taiwan. I find my Mandarin is miraculously much better at the night markets than it is when asking directions. Honestly I love being a poor mandarin speaker in Taiwan. I am pretty sure a good chunk of the population has better english than my mando, but if I start with madarin they will respond in kind 90% of the time. My theory is that they're happy for me to struggle with a language than to do the same themselves - fine by me, great opportunity to practice!
- 4y ago

wccrawford 4y ago

My wife and I went to Tokyo, and it stayed in a hotel by Disney. We spent like 4-5 days in Tokyo itself, and another 4-5 at the Disney parks. My experience, everywhere in Tokyo from small restaurants to Disney, was that everyone was nervous to try to speak English with me, but willing to try. Even the waitress at one restaurant that clearly didn't speak much English. When I tried to speak Japanese, they were delighted. My language partners have highly praised my accent, which I understand to mean that I'm not completely horrible. And I have a decent basic vocabulary and horrible grammar. I have had some instances (both in Tokyo and with my language partners who were not in Tokyo) where they suddenly started talking way above my level, and I had to ask them to explain things, but I think that's just the weirdness of talking to a full grown adult that speaks like a child, and trying to manage that situation.

imadethis 4y ago
The 日本語上手ですね！ (lit. your Japanese is good) phenomenon. You know you’ve made it when your Japanese stops getting complimented. Obligatory Dogen: https://youtu.be/Qmfipv-H4_o https://youtu.be/Qmfipv-H4_o
- senko 4y ago
  I believe this is true for most languages. I've had the same happen (and then stop happening, to my delight) to me with English (non-native speaker with fairly strong Eastern European accent).
  - throwawaymaths 4y ago
    Except french (in Paris and Quebec -- some other parts of France do this IME, no clue about the rest of the francophone world)
    - loufe 4y ago
      What do you mean to say here?
- 4y ago

dpifke 4y ago

I got really frustrated the first time I spent an extended period of time in Germany, and was trying to learn German. Every time I tried to practice the language, native speakers would immediately switch to English. I assumed this was because my German sucked. Someone finally explained to me that my beginner German was fine, but most people relished the opportunity to practice their English. I learned to just keep going in broken German, my conversation partner in broken English. For the most part, it worked.

TomK32 4y ago
As a German it took me quite some practice to get over this nicety and stick to German when talking with a foreigner who's bad at German but knows decent English.
t_mann 4y ago
There might be something else at play too - it's probably harder for them to remind themselves to slow down / speak in a sufficiently 'textbook-like' style in their own language than it is for them to switch to English.
Maultasche 4y ago
I had the same experience when I was doing an internship in Germany. One particular coworker kept speaking English to me, despite everyone else speaking German to me. At this point, I had lived there for a year already and spoke German pretty well, so comprehension definitely wasn't an issue. I think he was either used to speaking English with non-Germans or just liked having the opportunity to speak English. I just kept replying in German and he eventually switched to speaking German to me.
theturtle32 4y ago
I'm trying in earnest to learn Spanish, and am at intermediate level. I've had similar experiences trying to use Spanish in various contexts particularly in Southern California where I live, where there are a ton of native Spanish speakers that also speak English, and most of them speak FAR better English than I speak Spanish. Years into my language-learning adventure, I continue to feel super intimidated to try to use my Spanish here, locally, because people so often compliment my accent but the conversation quickly switches to English. I always feel like I'm creating frustration and inconvenience by trying to practice my Spanish, though it could just be my nervousness and desire to people-please that lead me to feel that way. I've had more of this kind of experience (Me speaking intermediate Spanish, with my conversation partner speaking intermediate English) in places outside of my home area where people are more likely to speak Spanish than English on a regular basis: a range of Latin American countries that I've visited, and especially when I visited the U.S. territory of Puerto Rico.