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There are legal requirements for enhanced emergency calling in European cars. Cars must have the ability to alert emergency responders with location data. Don’t

There are legal requirements for enhanced emergency calling in European cars. Cars must have the ability to alert emergency responders with location data. Don’t expect to be able to disable internet in cars going forward.

jhoechtl 4y ago
The Chinese government at least is not in disguise about their surveillance plans whereas we see it sneaked in into more and more appliances of daily use. I hate this coming Orwellian future.
- Cthulhu_ 4y ago
  Eh? The EU directives are all above board and documented, so I'm not sure what you're referring to. That said, they do need to be monitored at all time; abusing that location data for different usage is only one piece of legislation away. Which is why it's probably best to not gather this information in the first place. To invoke Godwin's Law, iirc you are no longer required to fill in your religion anywhere, because the nazi's used records like that to track down Jewish people and others they were after. This is why these privacy laws are so important, and why the right to be forgotten should be sacred; you should be able to disappear if the governments turn against you.
  - jhoechtl 4y ago
    You read or interpret this wrong. The EU government might be acting in good intention and I acknowledge that. Yet consumer electronics has the means to collect data for profiling like crazy. EU government data privacy acts are weak measures compared to liberal company laws with their seats outside the EU jurisdiction. Freemium will nudge far to many people to give away their data. An GDPR relevancy outside the EU is just a paper promise.
    - Gare 4y ago
      How would you sell a fridge or a car in the EU if you're not compliant?
  - phpisthebest 4y ago
    If you wait for the government to turn against you to attempt to "disappear" it already to late. The right to be forgotten is the wrong place to push for privacy, it should be the "right to never be known". As to the "EU directives are all above board and documented" you know what they say about the road to hell, and good intentions right?
    - PaulDavisThe1st 4y ago
      The right to never be known, in the sense in which I think you must mean it here, is fairly simple to obtain. Stay off the internet and stay off cell networks. Oh, you mean you want to be able to have your devices send requests to other people's devices and have them respond, but at the same time, you want there to be no record that your device ever did this? Good luck with that.
ekianjo 4y ago
how does that even fit with gdpr in europe? seems like a massive invasion of privacy without consent.
- frafra 4y ago
  https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/travel/security-and-emergencies/emergency-assistance-vehicles-ecall/index_en.htm#shortcut-3 https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/travel/security-and-em... https://ec.europa.eu/justice/article-29/documentation/opinion-recommendation/files/2006/wp125_en.pdf https://ec.europa.eu/justice/article-29/documentation/opinio... https://www.phoronix.com/forums/forum/phoronix/general-discussion/1035513-is-it-possible-to-disable-the-ecall-surveillance-system?p=1125873#post1125873 https://www.phoronix.com/forums/forum/phoronix/general-discu... It is mandatory to have it installed for new cars, but it looks like it can be disabled if the owner prefers to be left alone while dying, instead of calling an ambulance :D
  - xdennis 4y ago
    > it can be disabled if the owner prefers to be left alone while dying, instead of calling an ambulance :D Nobody prefers to die. It's the part where it's capable of being active all the time that's worrying. You also can't control the mandatory microphone. How long until someone abuses that (if it hasn't happened already)?
    - frafra 4y ago
      The device is built and tested according to some well-defined specifics; it is not connected to the network, and it is not capable of recording more than 3 positions and send them if an accident occurs, as well as establishing a phone call. Anything else is a violation perpetrated the manufacturer, as well as faking the specific tests that are formulated to check if the device is compliant: https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=celex:32017R0079 https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=celex:32... Abuses can always happen, and we should put reasonable checks in place to avoid them. Is the current regulation good enough to minimize the risk of having them? I hope so.
StanislavPetrov 4y ago
Nothing like the government stealing your freedoms "for your own good".

jhoechtl 4y ago

The Chinese government at least is not in disguise about their surveillance plans whereas we see it sneaked in into more and more appliances of daily use. I hate this coming Orwellian future.

Cthulhu_ 4y ago
Eh? The EU directives are all above board and documented, so I'm not sure what you're referring to. That said, they do need to be monitored at all time; abusing that location data for different usage is only one piece of legislation away. Which is why it's probably best to not gather this information in the first place. To invoke Godwin's Law, iirc you are no longer required to fill in your religion anywhere, because the nazi's used records like that to track down Jewish people and others they were after. This is why these privacy laws are so important, and why the right to be forgotten should be sacred; you should be able to disappear if the governments turn against you.
- jhoechtl 4y ago
  You read or interpret this wrong. The EU government might be acting in good intention and I acknowledge that. Yet consumer electronics has the means to collect data for profiling like crazy. EU government data privacy acts are weak measures compared to liberal company laws with their seats outside the EU jurisdiction. Freemium will nudge far to many people to give away their data. An GDPR relevancy outside the EU is just a paper promise.
  - Gare 4y ago
    How would you sell a fridge or a car in the EU if you're not compliant?
- phpisthebest 4y ago
  If you wait for the government to turn against you to attempt to "disappear" it already to late. The right to be forgotten is the wrong place to push for privacy, it should be the "right to never be known". As to the "EU directives are all above board and documented" you know what they say about the road to hell, and good intentions right?
  - PaulDavisThe1st 4y ago
    The right to never be known, in the sense in which I think you must mean it here, is fairly simple to obtain. Stay off the internet and stay off cell networks. Oh, you mean you want to be able to have your devices send requests to other people's devices and have them respond, but at the same time, you want there to be no record that your device ever did this? Good luck with that.

ekianjo 4y ago

how does that even fit with gdpr in europe? seems like a massive invasion of privacy without consent.

frafra 4y ago
https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/travel/security-and-emergencies/emergency-assistance-vehicles-ecall/index_en.htm#shortcut-3 https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/travel/security-and-em... https://ec.europa.eu/justice/article-29/documentation/opinion-recommendation/files/2006/wp125_en.pdf https://ec.europa.eu/justice/article-29/documentation/opinio... https://www.phoronix.com/forums/forum/phoronix/general-discussion/1035513-is-it-possible-to-disable-the-ecall-surveillance-system?p=1125873#post1125873 https://www.phoronix.com/forums/forum/phoronix/general-discu... It is mandatory to have it installed for new cars, but it looks like it can be disabled if the owner prefers to be left alone while dying, instead of calling an ambulance :D
- xdennis 4y ago
  > it can be disabled if the owner prefers to be left alone while dying, instead of calling an ambulance :D Nobody prefers to die. It's the part where it's capable of being active all the time that's worrying. You also can't control the mandatory microphone. How long until someone abuses that (if it hasn't happened already)?
  - frafra 4y ago
    The device is built and tested according to some well-defined specifics; it is not connected to the network, and it is not capable of recording more than 3 positions and send them if an accident occurs, as well as establishing a phone call. Anything else is a violation perpetrated the manufacturer, as well as faking the specific tests that are formulated to check if the device is compliant: https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=celex:32017R0079 https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=celex:32... Abuses can always happen, and we should put reasonable checks in place to avoid them. Is the current regulation good enough to minimize the risk of having them? I hope so.

StanislavPetrov 4y ago

Nothing like the government stealing your freedoms "for your own good".