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I swear this country is going to try to implement all of the worst aspects of China's authoritatiran system and claim it's all 'ok' because it's capitalist and

I swear this country is going to try to implement all of the worst aspects of China's authoritatiran system and claim it's all 'ok' because it's capitalist and to serve business instead of the govt. Implementing a Chinese style societal "social credit" system is not a good thing. Even if it would make it a bit cheaper to undercut Uber. Making every action and interation you have in life tracked and rated is not a net plus. The constant visibility and permanance of everything is part of why middle school and high schoolers are having such trouble now. They can't develop as teenagers as they are already part way to living in '1984' with every action tracked via social media. https://www.businessinsider.com/china-social-credit-system-punishments-and-rewards-explained-2018-4 https://www.businessinsider.com/china-social-credit-system-p... > The Chinese Communist Party has been constructing a moral ranking system for years that will monitor the behavior of its enormous population — and rank them all based on their "social credit." > But at the moment the system is piecemeal and voluntary, though the plan is for it to eventually be mandatory and unified across the nation, with each person given their own unique code used to measure their social credit score in real-time, per Wired. > The exact methodology is a secret — but examples of infractions include bad driving, smoking in non-smoking zones, buying too many video games, and posting fake news online, specifically about terrorist attacks or airport security. > Authorities banned people from purchasing flights 17.5 million times by the end of 2018, according to the National Public Credit Information Centre, as the Guardian reported. > And in July of 2018, a Chinese university denied an incoming student his spot because the student's father had a bad social credit score for failing to repay a loan. *Please* fellow tech people. Whether you work in ML, DS, or software for a random business or open source project please think through the societal impact and long-run end state of what you propose and produce. We really have to move past the days of "I'm just an engineer I'll only focus on the tech and ignore the impact of my work on society". Implementing China's societal wide social credit system is a bad path. And of course the argument will be, "well anyone who doesn't want to use it doesn't have to". And then that will turn into, "well most companies offer discounts if you use it." Then to "well most companies offer higher rates if you don't use it". Then "most companies won't serve you if you don't use it". Then it's universal in society just as if govt mandated, but people will consider it less horrific because it was slipery slope implemented vs via a mandate.

endisneigh 4y ago
It's not about capitalism - it's about trust. If you're meeting up with strangers how exactly can you do so safely?
- hackernewds 4y ago
  Through a credit system that is centralized, just like China's credit system. Except it's not even run by elected officials so there's no representation. it's a terrible idea and Boiled Cabbage makes a very good point
  - endisneigh 4y ago
    So you're against the idea of Uber, eBay, Care, Lyft, etc? Since what I'm describing already exists. Not to mention the credit bureaus. You'd prefer arbitrariness? If anything a single place for the trust would be better as it would be more thoroughly examined.
  - noirbot 4y ago
    The issue is that, while there's certainly reason to be worried about something like China's system, there's always going to some amount of ad-hoc or official systems of trust. Criminal background checks, sex offender registries, credit reports, professional licensing, your eBay buyer/seller rating, your religion, and whether or not someone looking at you just thinks you look creepy. It's certainly reasonable to think a system as massive and in-depth as what China is working on is too far, but the alternative in the far extreme is just looking at someone and going "do I trust this person", which isn't a great solution either, and is prone to the "you don't look like you're from around here" sorts of defaults. As with most things, the question isn't "should this exist at all". There will always be some sort of explicit or implicit system of trust. The question is where do you draw the lines between something like China's system and randomly picking someone and hoping they don't have a history of serious crimes/don't even know how to do whatever you need them to do. There's plenty of existing systems I think go too far, but I also would want to know that the person picking me up for a car trip had a driver's license.
- 4y ago

endisneigh 4y ago

It's not about capitalism - it's about trust. If you're meeting up with strangers how exactly can you do so safely?

hackernewds 4y ago
Through a credit system that is centralized, just like China's credit system. Except it's not even run by elected officials so there's no representation. it's a terrible idea and Boiled Cabbage makes a very good point
- endisneigh 4y ago
  So you're against the idea of Uber, eBay, Care, Lyft, etc? Since what I'm describing already exists. Not to mention the credit bureaus. You'd prefer arbitrariness? If anything a single place for the trust would be better as it would be more thoroughly examined.
- noirbot 4y ago
  The issue is that, while there's certainly reason to be worried about something like China's system, there's always going to some amount of ad-hoc or official systems of trust. Criminal background checks, sex offender registries, credit reports, professional licensing, your eBay buyer/seller rating, your religion, and whether or not someone looking at you just thinks you look creepy. It's certainly reasonable to think a system as massive and in-depth as what China is working on is too far, but the alternative in the far extreme is just looking at someone and going "do I trust this person", which isn't a great solution either, and is prone to the "you don't look like you're from around here" sorts of defaults. As with most things, the question isn't "should this exist at all". There will always be some sort of explicit or implicit system of trust. The question is where do you draw the lines between something like China's system and randomly picking someone and hoping they don't have a history of serious crimes/don't even know how to do whatever you need them to do. There's plenty of existing systems I think go too far, but I also would want to know that the person picking me up for a car trip had a driver's license.
4y ago