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I just wanted to say, I really don't appreciate the sarcasm in the first couple of paragraphs. Anybody can take someone's comment and negate each of the sentenc
by javert 4y ago
I just wanted to say, I really don't appreciate the sarcasm in the first couple of paragraphs. Anybody can take someone's comment and negate each of the sentences. It's only clever and cute if the new version is kind of self-evidently true or somehow insightful. In this case, it's not.
You're also setting up a straw man with the comment about workers' rights. A call for the government to "fix inequality" with something like the New Deal is not a call for workers' rights. It's implicitly a call for the government to run much more of the economy than it already does. There is no other way to achieve the stated objective in the stated way.
Playing the old "fit about socialism" card is not impressive. I never used the word "socialism" because it's a slippery word that leads to low quality discussion. It's beside the point. Is every argument against government management magically defeated by the "OMG SOCIALISM" sarcasm that left wing people always trot out like this?
Also, probably needless to say, I disagree with your analysis.
edit: I will respond to the following:
> In reality, it is very well known - by psychology, by statistics, and by empiricism - that societies that don't allow the most powerful to make unchecked decisions based on their current level of resources do better than those who do.
That's simply not true that this is "very well known." And you are conflating political power (which is what we call "power") with economic power (which isn't what we normally call "power"). The power of Bill Gates or Warren Buffet is limited mostly to doing good or just losing their money. That has nothing to do with the power weilded by, say, the Dept. of Homeland Security, or the American medical insurance industry (which gets its power through regulatory graft backed by political power and ultimately force). Forceful power, i.e. "power," is just not comparable to the "power" one gets by voluntarily trading with others.
It's silly to say your non sequitur is "well known" by "psychology" or "statistics" (what do those have to do with it, anyway) or "empiricism." That's nothing like my saying that something is "well known" to history. 20th century history is straightforward and direct (and relevant) in a way that psychology and statistics are not. We have tried big government management many times and it always fails. Look at the many communist countries that actually stayed communist (i.e. China doesn't count, but it's a shit show anyway). Look at fascist-nationalist command economies like the Nazis and today's Russians. Those societies and economies evidently do not work. (I would add, look at the outcome of the New Deal, but that is more nuanced.) There is no way a psychology paper could have that kind of evidentiary power.
- avgcorrection 4y ago> I just wanted to say, I really don't appreciate the sarcasm in the first couple of paragraphs. Anybody can take someone's comment and negate each of the sentences. It's only clever and cute if the new version is kind of self-evidently true or somehow insightful. In this case, it's not. When you say it: just spitting facts, being no-nonsense. When someone else uses the same device to say the opposite: vile sarcasm which is not on-point or even funny since it is obviously false (you hold the opposite opinion so of course it is: it is self-evident).
- javert 4y agoA comment that negates each sentence of what it's responding to is not using the "same device." It's being sarcastic. Using the "same device" would be saying, "I think the opposite is self-evident..." and then elaborating.
- avgcorrection 4y agoI think the opposite is self-evident. The idea that private management and allocation of capital can do better than government management of the economy is ridiculous. This has been proven many times over by post-industrial history, and is also immediately obvious if you've ever been to the airport. Or if you know anything about the inner workings of a complex modern commercial apparatus, such as any investment bank, or Enron. --- Sarcasm is when you repeat something without negating it, but indicating that you really think the opposite (negation). Saying “private sector management doesn’t work” and meaning it is not sarcasm.
- javert 4y agoThe definition I found of sarcasm is the following: "a sharp and often satirical or ironic utterance designed to cut or give pain" I think the response I'm complaining about is satirical, so I think it matches sarcasm by this definition. Anyway, even if hadn't been sarcasm, technically, it seems mocking and unkind. And it's not a big deal, but I think my response of "I don't appreciate that" was pretty tit for tat.