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I have taken both jnj and Moderna. But I have to admit that the grandparent has a point. It feels it’s almost heretical to say, but the vaccines were terribly o

I have taken both jnj and Moderna. But I have to admit that the grandparent has a point. It feels it’s almost heretical to say, but the vaccines were terribly over-sold. In the beginning they were sold as traditional vaccines - prevention against infection not just serious disease. But very soon we saw “breakthrough infections” (not even written about anymore as they are so common) and the goal posts started being moved. Public health establishment deserves a D- for their handling of the pandemic starting basically on day 1.

throwaway5752 4y ago
The virus mutated and became more resistant, nobody should have to explain that to a grown-ass adult. The General Public deserves an F for civic-mindedness, being able to ascertain good sources of information on the internet, and scientific literacy. It's a miracle the vaccines were available as soon they were and it prevent hundreds of thousands if not millions of deaths globally. And you are mad about 3rd party marketing. We all collectively deserve what's coming.
- ianai 4y ago
  What do you figure is coming? It sort of seems we now have more tame variants than the first several, at least. This news about long term effects even after vaccination is pretty concerning, though.
twblalock 4y ago
> Public health establishment deserves a D- for their handling of the pandemic starting basically on day 1. D- for clear communication and providing leadership to the public? Definitely! D- for the vaccines though? Definitely not! The vaccines have dramatically reduced the death rate from the disease. The disease mutated to bypass the vaccine -- yet the vaccine still provides a lot of protection despite that. What more can you realistically expect?
- encoderer 4y ago
  Yes agreed
ryandrake 4y ago
> But very soon we saw “breakthrough infections” (not even written about anymore as they are so common) and the goal posts started being moved. It's almost as if we learned new things as time went on and more observations were made, and adjusted expectations and actions based on that new information. I know, total crazy talk.
- encoderer 4y ago
  You act like I am inventing the concept of credibility. If you routinely say things you then have to walk back (don’t wear masks, vaccines prevent infection) then you have to expect that your credibility is damaged.
kosherhurricane 4y ago
Covid was a novel virus, which means it was and still is a poorly understood virus. Vaccines came out fast and worked well because we had a new tech platform (mRNA). But it’s starting to look like sarscov2 has immunity evading abilities, which is something that scientists were not able to work out until now. The immunity evading ability should scare everyone at this point, but humans don’t do well with long term bad news when short term pain is involved.
- spookthesunset 4y ago
  > Covid was a novel virus, which means it was and still is a poorly understood virus. I'm sorry, but that just isn't true. In what way is covid so new that we need to throw out our entire body of knowledge surrounding viruses and respiratory illnesses?

throwaway5752 4y ago

The virus mutated and became more resistant, nobody should have to explain that to a grown-ass adult. The General Public deserves an F for civic-mindedness, being able to ascertain good sources of information on the internet, and scientific literacy. It's a miracle the vaccines were available as soon they were and it prevent hundreds of thousands if not millions of deaths globally. And you are mad about 3rd party marketing. We all collectively deserve what's coming.

ianai 4y ago
What do you figure is coming? It sort of seems we now have more tame variants than the first several, at least. This news about long term effects even after vaccination is pretty concerning, though.

twblalock 4y ago

> Public health establishment deserves a D- for their handling of the pandemic starting basically on day 1. D- for clear communication and providing leadership to the public? Definitely! D- for the vaccines though? Definitely not! The vaccines have dramatically reduced the death rate from the disease. The disease mutated to bypass the vaccine -- yet the vaccine still provides a lot of protection despite that. What more can you realistically expect?

encoderer 4y ago
Yes agreed

ryandrake 4y ago

> But very soon we saw “breakthrough infections” (not even written about anymore as they are so common) and the goal posts started being moved. It's almost as if we learned new things as time went on and more observations were made, and adjusted expectations and actions based on that new information. I know, total crazy talk.

encoderer 4y ago
You act like I am inventing the concept of credibility. If you routinely say things you then have to walk back (don’t wear masks, vaccines prevent infection) then you have to expect that your credibility is damaged.

kosherhurricane 4y ago

Covid was a novel virus, which means it was and still is a poorly understood virus. Vaccines came out fast and worked well because we had a new tech platform (mRNA). But it’s starting to look like sarscov2 has immunity evading abilities, which is something that scientists were not able to work out until now. The immunity evading ability should scare everyone at this point, but humans don’t do well with long term bad news when short term pain is involved.

spookthesunset 4y ago
> Covid was a novel virus, which means it was and still is a poorly understood virus. I'm sorry, but that just isn't true. In what way is covid so new that we need to throw out our entire body of knowledge surrounding viruses and respiratory illnesses?