4 ms·

Bolt fires employees that have stock options loans

11 points by aabedraba 4y ago

gbronner 4y ago
Leverage kills
draw_down 4y ago
blablabla123 4y ago
What a bad company. Also just 2 weeks ago a recruiter from them wrote me on LinkedIn that they are looking to fill various positions
LatteLazy 4y ago
I thought the whole point of stock options was they were given? Why would you buy them through a loan? I don't do that for other companies, I wouldn't do it with my employer...
- kd5bjo 4y ago
  From my limited understanding, in order for options to not be taxed as income by the IRS, the strike price must be the actual stock price when the option is issued. I presume that the loan in question is to cover the exercise cost for the options, so that employees can afford to hold the shares instead of immediately liquidating them. Personally, I don’t like holding shares of my employer: There’s too much risk that an adverse event will take out both my salary and my savings at the same time.
- salawat 4y ago
  Options have a tendency to disappear 90 days after cessation of employment. The point is to buy in when Stock is cheap, so that you're in a good position to reap the gravy train come IPO time. You have to actually hold those shares at that time, ehich requires exercising. Exercising involves some level of risk. If you aren't sure your employer is going to make it, or is really aligned to do good for the market, it is entirely rational not to put your money on the line. Equity compensation is a way to, in theory, keep incentives aligned. You're in a position to eventually get out what you put in. Taking out loans to buy more options than you are granted, or to cover the cost of exercising is basically adding a layer of confidence in success. Hard pill to swallow in this case though.
  - gruez 4y ago
    >Options have a tendency to disappear 90 days after cessation of employment but according to a thread by CEO (?)[1] they made the exercise window "several years". That means the main advantage of taking the loans while you're still employed, is to get favorable tax treatment, ie. >The capital gains clock begins AFTER options are exercised, meaning employees have to wait at least a year to get capital gains tax benefits Looking at only the federal rates[2], if you earn between $204k and $459k, your marginal tax rate would be 35% but your capital gains rate would only be 15%, netting you a 20% savings on tax. [1] https://twitter.com/theryanking/status/1493390184897032201 https://twitter.com/theryanking/status/1493390184897032201 [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Income_tax_in_the_United_States#Capital_gains https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Income_tax_in_the_United_State...
gruez 4y ago
The title is misleading. Sure, it's technically true in the sense that employees with loans were fired, but the wording suggests they were targeted for having the loans. For instance, consider the following statements: "Bolt fires employees that have children" "Bolt fires employees that worked from home" "Bolt fires employees that had reddit accounts" A far less misleading title would be something like "Fired Bolt employees on the hook for stock option loans"

11 points by aabedraba 4y ago

gbronner 4y ago

Leverage kills

draw_down 4y ago

blablabla123 4y ago

What a bad company. Also just 2 weeks ago a recruiter from them wrote me on LinkedIn that they are looking to fill various positions

LatteLazy 4y ago

I thought the whole point of stock options was they were given? Why would you buy them through a loan? I don't do that for other companies, I wouldn't do it with my employer...

kd5bjo 4y ago
From my limited understanding, in order for options to not be taxed as income by the IRS, the strike price must be the actual stock price when the option is issued. I presume that the loan in question is to cover the exercise cost for the options, so that employees can afford to hold the shares instead of immediately liquidating them. Personally, I don’t like holding shares of my employer: There’s too much risk that an adverse event will take out both my salary and my savings at the same time.
salawat 4y ago
Options have a tendency to disappear 90 days after cessation of employment. The point is to buy in when Stock is cheap, so that you're in a good position to reap the gravy train come IPO time. You have to actually hold those shares at that time, ehich requires exercising. Exercising involves some level of risk. If you aren't sure your employer is going to make it, or is really aligned to do good for the market, it is entirely rational not to put your money on the line. Equity compensation is a way to, in theory, keep incentives aligned. You're in a position to eventually get out what you put in. Taking out loans to buy more options than you are granted, or to cover the cost of exercising is basically adding a layer of confidence in success. Hard pill to swallow in this case though.
- gruez 4y ago
  >Options have a tendency to disappear 90 days after cessation of employment but according to a thread by CEO (?)[1] they made the exercise window "several years". That means the main advantage of taking the loans while you're still employed, is to get favorable tax treatment, ie. >The capital gains clock begins AFTER options are exercised, meaning employees have to wait at least a year to get capital gains tax benefits Looking at only the federal rates[2], if you earn between $204k and $459k, your marginal tax rate would be 35% but your capital gains rate would only be 15%, netting you a 20% savings on tax. [1] https://twitter.com/theryanking/status/1493390184897032201 https://twitter.com/theryanking/status/1493390184897032201 [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Income_tax_in_the_United_States#Capital_gains https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Income_tax_in_the_United_State...

gruez 4y ago

The title is misleading. Sure, it's technically true in the sense that employees with loans were fired, but the wording suggests they were targeted for having the loans. For instance, consider the following statements: "Bolt fires employees that have children" "Bolt fires employees that worked from home" "Bolt fires employees that had reddit accounts" A far less misleading title would be something like "Fired Bolt employees on the hook for stock option loans"