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> For example USA gun ownership: 120/100 people [0]. Australia gun ownership: 30/100. So maybe 4 times any many guns in the USA. But gun homicides: 4.12/100 in

by cudgy 4y ago

> For example USA gun ownership: 120/100 people [0]. Australia gun ownership: 30/100. So maybe 4 times any many guns in the USA. But gun homicides: 4.12/100 in the USA, 0.18 in Australia. 22 times higher > The fact the the USA's civil society hasn't managed that makes us think you yankees are a little odd. First, your stat on US homicide is off by a factor of 1,000. It should read 4.12/100,000. This is going to be controversial, but the facts are the facts. Gun homicides in the US are vastly skewed toward a single group of people in urban areas. 34.9 gun homicide victims per 100,000 people are blacks. 1.5 gun homicide victims per 100,000 people are whites. Blacks are 23.3 times higher than whites to be victims of a gun homicide. Furthermore, the black victims lived in large urban areas and were shot by other blacks around 90% of the time. Now, some articles suggest that most guns are owned by white men, but I do not share the same trust in the estimate of guns that you may. How are these estimates arrived at? Anyway, assuming that one accepts the premise that most guns are owned by white men in rural America and that proliferation of guns is the main cause of gun homicides, why aren’t most gun homicides committed in rural areas by white men? Do you see the problem? Or are Australians a little odd? The issue appears to not be due to high numbers of guns. It appears to be highly concentrated in urban black communities. So why is this not discussed by the media and mostly Democratic politicians, especially when it ravages blacks in urban communities that are governed by politicians that are Democrats? Probably for the same reason that my response which is based on cold hard statistics will be flagged or voted down. The oddity of the US is not the people, but the pathetic politicians that are more concerned about a political talking point than finding the root cause of the issue. https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7042a6.htm https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7042a6.htm

rstuart4133 4y ago
> So why is this not discussed by the media and mostly Democratic politicians, especially when it ravages blacks in urban communities that are governed by politicians that are Democrats? One of the "facts are the facts" things you seem to have missed is gun related deaths are highest (by far) in the Republican states. I don't whether that means it's a Republican or Democrat issue. I'm not from the USA I don't know the politics that well, but from a distance, it does look like it's mainly Republicans who say things like "the answer to the gun problem is more people wearing guns". As for black vs white. There is a kernel of truth there - there is more violence in black communities, about double the death rates from what I can tell. But blacks only constitute 13% of the USA population. If you remove them the USA gun rates are still far higher than rest of the world - and that statistical difference is caused by the 80% white population, not the blacks. And that's just homicides. Most gun related deaths are suicides, which are also obscenely high in the USA. When it comes to suicides, the figures are reversed - whites have over double the rates of blacks. That means when you include all gun related deaths, the whites actually worse rates than the blacks. > more concerned about a political talking point than finding the root cause of the issue. That is a downright weird observation. It was _you_ who introduced the Republican / Democrat divide here as a talking point, not some politician. It was you who brought in the largely irrelevant race issue, rather looking for a root cause. If you looking change the discussion into an honest one that might address the issue (assuming you want it addressed), then I'd start with the person in the mirror. If you can change him, you can probably convince anyone.

by cudgy 4y ago

rstuart4133 4y ago

> So why is this not discussed by the media and mostly Democratic politicians, especially when it ravages blacks in urban communities that are governed by politicians that are Democrats? One of the "facts are the facts" things you seem to have missed is gun related deaths are highest (by far) in the Republican states. I don't whether that means it's a Republican or Democrat issue. I'm not from the USA I don't know the politics that well, but from a distance, it does look like it's mainly Republicans who say things like "the answer to the gun problem is more people wearing guns". As for black vs white. There is a kernel of truth there - there is more violence in black communities, about double the death rates from what I can tell. But blacks only constitute 13% of the USA population. If you remove them the USA gun rates are still far higher than rest of the world - and that statistical difference is caused by the 80% white population, not the blacks. And that's just homicides. Most gun related deaths are suicides, which are also obscenely high in the USA. When it comes to suicides, the figures are reversed - whites have over double the rates of blacks. That means when you include all gun related deaths, the whites actually worse rates than the blacks. > more concerned about a political talking point than finding the root cause of the issue. That is a downright weird observation. It was _you_ who introduced the Republican / Democrat divide here as a talking point, not some politician. It was you who brought in the largely irrelevant race issue, rather looking for a root cause. If you looking change the discussion into an honest one that might address the issue (assuming you want it addressed), then I'd start with the person in the mirror. If you can change him, you can probably convince anyone.