3 ms·

AR-15s are also effective for self-defense purposes. You can also build an AR-15 with a block of metal, a CNC machine, and plans that are freely available on t

AR-15s are also effective for self-defense purposes. You can also build an AR-15 with a block of metal, a CNC machine, and plans that are freely available on the Internet. There is no effective means by which you could prevent an AR-15 from ending up in peoples' hands.

multjoy 4y ago
A golf club is also effective for self defence purposes. In any case, those same tools are available globally and AR15s simply aren't ending up in people's hands, or the hands of school shooters.
- lliamander 4y ago
  > A golf club is also effective for self defence purposes I don't think you have any idea what you are talking about.
  - multjoy 4y ago
    Point me to any other country in the western world where the concept of self defence is predicated on the possession of an AR15 capable of discharging 30 high-velocity rifle rounds in fifteen seconds. Presumably, as your idea of self defence is overwhelming firepower, you spend your days campaigning against the ban on automatic weapons?
    - lliamander 4y ago
      > Point me to any other country in the western world where the concept of self defence is predicated on the possession of an AR15 capable of discharging 30 high-velocity rifle rounds in fifteen seconds. Prohibitions on such weapons do not reduce the overall violent crime rate, so I don't see why it matters. > Presumably, as your idea of self defence is overwhelming firepower, you spend your days campaigning against the ban on automatic weapons? What you imagine I think or do has no bearing on the arguments at hand.
ohgodplsno 4y ago
>There is no effective means by which you could prevent an AR-15 from ending up in peoples' hands. >a block of metal, a CNC machine Try not to argue in bad faith as a gun owner challenge (IMPOSSIBLE) Half of your arguments are "regular men need to defend their houses" and "but black people shoot eachother in the ghetto too". Hint: these are in complete opposition to "Having enough time, money and access to a CNC Machine to make a homemade shitty AR15". Making guns less accessible means less shootings, period.
- lliamander 4y ago
  > Hint: these are in complete opposition They are not. Black people have a right to self-defense the same as everyone else. The point is that gun violence in the United States is not uniform or random, but rather connected with specific set of social conditions. Ameliorating those specific social problems would reduce violent crime rates without the need to disarm peaceful civilians.
j2bax 4y ago
Most mass shootings reported in the past few years have been committed with guns that were legally purchased by either the shooter or a family member. Surely illegally manufacturing your own gun (or finding someone willing to illegally do it for you) is a barrier to most would be school shooters.
confidantlake 4y ago
How many mentally ill school shooters would actually build an AR-15 out of a block of metal? 1%? 0.1%?
jrockway 4y ago
I'm guessing you need a 4 or 5 axis machine to make a gun. These cost more than the buildings that you need to contain them. (OK, there's this guy, but probably not big enough: https://pocketnc.com/ https://pocketnc.com/.) I don't think it's unreasonable to say that if you need to own and know how to operate a CNC mill in order to do a mass shooting, mass shootings are going to decrease. CNC is not "hit print", it's a skill that requires training and development. (Looking at /r/3DPrinting, I can tell you that many people manage to screw that up. CNC is like 3D printing, but about 10x harder. Some may argue that you need some more zeroes on there, actually.)
- lliamander 4y ago
  The technology is improving all the time. The "0% receiver" from Ghost Gunner only came out within the past year. It is also not necessary for a every person wanting to build a rifle to own a CNC machine. As it is, it would be both legally and practically infeasible outlaw and confiscate AR-15s.

multjoy 4y ago

A golf club is also effective for self defence purposes. In any case, those same tools are available globally and AR15s simply aren't ending up in people's hands, or the hands of school shooters.

lliamander 4y ago
> A golf club is also effective for self defence purposes I don't think you have any idea what you are talking about.
- multjoy 4y ago
  Point me to any other country in the western world where the concept of self defence is predicated on the possession of an AR15 capable of discharging 30 high-velocity rifle rounds in fifteen seconds. Presumably, as your idea of self defence is overwhelming firepower, you spend your days campaigning against the ban on automatic weapons?
  - lliamander 4y ago
    > Point me to any other country in the western world where the concept of self defence is predicated on the possession of an AR15 capable of discharging 30 high-velocity rifle rounds in fifteen seconds. Prohibitions on such weapons do not reduce the overall violent crime rate, so I don't see why it matters. > Presumably, as your idea of self defence is overwhelming firepower, you spend your days campaigning against the ban on automatic weapons? What you imagine I think or do has no bearing on the arguments at hand.

ohgodplsno 4y ago

>There is no effective means by which you could prevent an AR-15 from ending up in peoples' hands. >a block of metal, a CNC machine Try not to argue in bad faith as a gun owner challenge (IMPOSSIBLE) Half of your arguments are "regular men need to defend their houses" and "but black people shoot eachother in the ghetto too". Hint: these are in complete opposition to "Having enough time, money and access to a CNC Machine to make a homemade shitty AR15". Making guns less accessible means less shootings, period.

lliamander 4y ago
> Hint: these are in complete opposition They are not. Black people have a right to self-defense the same as everyone else. The point is that gun violence in the United States is not uniform or random, but rather connected with specific set of social conditions. Ameliorating those specific social problems would reduce violent crime rates without the need to disarm peaceful civilians.

j2bax 4y ago

Most mass shootings reported in the past few years have been committed with guns that were legally purchased by either the shooter or a family member. Surely illegally manufacturing your own gun (or finding someone willing to illegally do it for you) is a barrier to most would be school shooters.

confidantlake 4y ago

How many mentally ill school shooters would actually build an AR-15 out of a block of metal? 1%? 0.1%?

jrockway 4y ago

I'm guessing you need a 4 or 5 axis machine to make a gun. These cost more than the buildings that you need to contain them. (OK, there's this guy, but probably not big enough: https://pocketnc.com/ https://pocketnc.com/.) I don't think it's unreasonable to say that if you need to own and know how to operate a CNC mill in order to do a mass shooting, mass shootings are going to decrease. CNC is not "hit print", it's a skill that requires training and development. (Looking at /r/3DPrinting, I can tell you that many people manage to screw that up. CNC is like 3D printing, but about 10x harder. Some may argue that you need some more zeroes on there, actually.)

lliamander 4y ago
The technology is improving all the time. The "0% receiver" from Ghost Gunner only came out within the past year. It is also not necessary for a every person wanting to build a rifle to own a CNC machine. As it is, it would be both legally and practically infeasible outlaw and confiscate AR-15s.