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I have a 10 and an 8 year old, and I don't agree that kids will find their own thing. I have to apply a fair amount of pressure to get 20 minutes of reading hom

I have a 10 and an 8 year old, and I don't agree that kids will find their own thing. I have to apply a fair amount of pressure to get 20 minutes of reading homework on school nights. I even have to apply some pressure to get them to put their laundry in the basket and put their clean clothes away. There are heaps of things that just aren't that fun but that are actually important.

beebmam 4y ago
As long as you keep your kids away from addictive things, like social media, cell phones, heavily processed foods, drugs, sex, etc, they'll probably figure things out all right. But it seems easier than ever to fall into cycles of addiction in this era, no matter where you live on earth. So I'd say pushing kids away from those things is necessary. Beyond that, I'm not so sure.
- bscphil 4y ago
  Yeah, I think this gets at something important. If the options are homework, reading a book, building something, or playing Fortnight, 90% of kids are going to pick the video game. If most of the time they only have the first three options, finding a better balance is going to be easier. Forcing children to do one particular thing (above and beyond what is required to survive in this cruel world) is probably bad. Making sure the options they have to choose from are healthy, non-addictive, and engaging is probably necessary, though.
  - manmal 4y ago
    It’s pretty complicated, because from a certain age they might spend time with friends who exclusively play Fortnite, and talk about nothing else. Additionally, if we just limit screen time too much, that might lead to a feeling of scarcity, and overindulgence when the chance presents itself.
    - vanilla_nut 4y ago
      Worth noting that in car-dependent hellish suburban and rural America, video games may be the only way kids can socialize on an average weeknight, especially if they aren’t interested in sports. It’s tricky to let your kids socialize but also keep them away from toxic platforms like TikTok, Facebook, Instagram, etc.
shkkmo 4y ago
Chores and homework are a long way from forced hobbies and careers. The question is about pushing your kids to do things you think they should like.
- jay_kyburz 4y ago
  It wasn't when the OP first posted the comment.
  - shkkmo 4y ago
    It was, the intent hasn't changed. I commented to try to clarify that intent before the top comment was edited to include it's own clarification.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - manmal 4y ago
    Sorry for that, I also commented on your initial reply to point out my edit. I agree with you about chores. There seem to be cultures who have it easier in that regard (kids derive purpose from doing chores), but those cultures have a totally different day to day life.
manmal 4y ago
I agree. I was under the impression that this thread is about self-actualization, and not about chores. But I see how my comment can leave the impression of a wider scope, so I added a clarification at the top.
cycomanic 4y ago
I recently came across Jane Nelson and positive discipline [1] which I found quite enlightening. I think we often underestimate how well kids understand the importance of things if we sit down and treat them as equals. That said sometimes everyone needs a push, but I think it is important not to push something that is not being enjoyed at all just because "it is good for you". [1] https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8_h44xFO12U https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8_h44xFO12U
BizarroLand 4y ago
Kids have to be pushed to clean up after themselves, to be polite, to mind their manners. Wild children will most often eventually learn to fit in and stay there, but they will take torturous paths to get to that point whereas Stepford children are likely to look great on paper but grow up resenting the people who took away their autonomy for appearances' sake. Neither extreme (Wild/Stepford) is a good thing, Wild Children tend to get into and cause a lot of trouble, and end up missing out on opportunities both personal and interpersonal due to their lack of grounding and inability to meet societal pressures/standards. Stepford kids (at least in my anecdotal experience) tend to end up rebelling hard, or developing a need to hide their flaws and issues out of fear of reprisal, and sometimes end up having huge breakdowns because their fundamental emotional and developmental needs aren't being met. Sounds like Wil was forced to be a Stepford child, and this is the consequence of that, not to mention his mother both abusing him and allowing him to be abused by other people while wringing every penny she could get out of him in the process. That's pretty shitty.

beebmam 4y ago

As long as you keep your kids away from addictive things, like social media, cell phones, heavily processed foods, drugs, sex, etc, they'll probably figure things out all right. But it seems easier than ever to fall into cycles of addiction in this era, no matter where you live on earth. So I'd say pushing kids away from those things is necessary. Beyond that, I'm not so sure.

bscphil 4y ago
Yeah, I think this gets at something important. If the options are homework, reading a book, building something, or playing Fortnight, 90% of kids are going to pick the video game. If most of the time they only have the first three options, finding a better balance is going to be easier. Forcing children to do one particular thing (above and beyond what is required to survive in this cruel world) is probably bad. Making sure the options they have to choose from are healthy, non-addictive, and engaging is probably necessary, though.
- manmal 4y ago
  It’s pretty complicated, because from a certain age they might spend time with friends who exclusively play Fortnite, and talk about nothing else. Additionally, if we just limit screen time too much, that might lead to a feeling of scarcity, and overindulgence when the chance presents itself.
  - vanilla_nut 4y ago
    Worth noting that in car-dependent hellish suburban and rural America, video games may be the only way kids can socialize on an average weeknight, especially if they aren’t interested in sports. It’s tricky to let your kids socialize but also keep them away from toxic platforms like TikTok, Facebook, Instagram, etc.

shkkmo 4y ago

Chores and homework are a long way from forced hobbies and careers. The question is about pushing your kids to do things you think they should like.

jay_kyburz 4y ago
It wasn't when the OP first posted the comment.
- shkkmo 4y ago
  It was, the intent hasn't changed. I commented to try to clarify that intent before the top comment was edited to include it's own clarification.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- manmal 4y ago
  Sorry for that, I also commented on your initial reply to point out my edit. I agree with you about chores. There seem to be cultures who have it easier in that regard (kids derive purpose from doing chores), but those cultures have a totally different day to day life.

manmal 4y ago

I agree. I was under the impression that this thread is about self-actualization, and not about chores. But I see how my comment can leave the impression of a wider scope, so I added a clarification at the top.

cycomanic 4y ago

I recently came across Jane Nelson and positive discipline [1] which I found quite enlightening. I think we often underestimate how well kids understand the importance of things if we sit down and treat them as equals. That said sometimes everyone needs a push, but I think it is important not to push something that is not being enjoyed at all just because "it is good for you". [1] https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8_h44xFO12U https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8_h44xFO12U

BizarroLand 4y ago

Kids have to be pushed to clean up after themselves, to be polite, to mind their manners. Wild children will most often eventually learn to fit in and stay there, but they will take torturous paths to get to that point whereas Stepford children are likely to look great on paper but grow up resenting the people who took away their autonomy for appearances' sake. Neither extreme (Wild/Stepford) is a good thing, Wild Children tend to get into and cause a lot of trouble, and end up missing out on opportunities both personal and interpersonal due to their lack of grounding and inability to meet societal pressures/standards. Stepford kids (at least in my anecdotal experience) tend to end up rebelling hard, or developing a need to hide their flaws and issues out of fear of reprisal, and sometimes end up having huge breakdowns because their fundamental emotional and developmental needs aren't being met. Sounds like Wil was forced to be a Stepford child, and this is the consequence of that, not to mention his mother both abusing him and allowing him to be abused by other people while wringing every penny she could get out of him in the process. That's pretty shitty.