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1491 was reporting on archeology, cutting edge archeology for when it was written in 2005. It's nice to see the field progressing but it wasn't like Mann was gu

1491 was reporting on archeology, cutting edge archeology for when it was written in 2005. It's nice to see the field progressing but it wasn't like Mann was guessing! I'm just eager for a new book updated with all the findings since that book was written.

mooreds 4y ago
I'd buy that book for sure. 1491 was eye opening for me in the same way that few books are. Others that come to mind: Guns Germs and Steel Godel Escher Bach
- jfengel 4y ago
  Guns Germs and Steel is widely considered discredited by anthropologists. It introduces a lot of concepts that were previously unfamiliar to the layman (not unlike Godel, Escher, Bach), but it has a lot of weaknesses and is much too strong in its conclusions. It's worth reading the quick overview in Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guns,_Germs,_and_Steel#Criticism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guns,_Germs,_and_Steel#Critici... I'm not saying it shouldn't be eye-opening, but just that you should take it with a large grain of salt. It's not as definitive as is commonly thought.
  - MichaelZuo 4y ago
    Some of those critiques introduce additional assumptions that Diamond's arguments don't rely on: "has almost no role for human agency—the ability people have to make decisions and influence outcomes. Europeans become inadvertent, accidental conquerors. Natives succumb passively to their fate." Assumes a conquest due to technological and other disparities implies a lack of human agency on both sides. Why wouldn't the level of human agency everywhere remain roughly constant pre and post colonization regardless of what happened? The only way I can make sense of this is if the writer assumes 'human agency' is some magical force that can overcome every other factor. "Diamond's account makes all the factors of European domination a product of a distant and accidental history" Assumes all 'factors' arose as a result of events in the distant past. Gunpowder, which was spread from China via the silk road, clearly and immediately was put to use fairly soon after the Spanish got hold of it, within a few generations. etc.
  - mooreds 4y ago
    Thanks, I wasn't aware of the critiques!

mooreds 4y ago

I'd buy that book for sure. 1491 was eye opening for me in the same way that few books are. Others that come to mind: Guns Germs and Steel Godel Escher Bach

jfengel 4y ago
Guns Germs and Steel is widely considered discredited by anthropologists. It introduces a lot of concepts that were previously unfamiliar to the layman (not unlike Godel, Escher, Bach), but it has a lot of weaknesses and is much too strong in its conclusions. It's worth reading the quick overview in Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guns,_Germs,_and_Steel#Criticism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guns,_Germs,_and_Steel#Critici... I'm not saying it shouldn't be eye-opening, but just that you should take it with a large grain of salt. It's not as definitive as is commonly thought.
- MichaelZuo 4y ago
  Some of those critiques introduce additional assumptions that Diamond's arguments don't rely on: "has almost no role for human agency—the ability people have to make decisions and influence outcomes. Europeans become inadvertent, accidental conquerors. Natives succumb passively to their fate." Assumes a conquest due to technological and other disparities implies a lack of human agency on both sides. Why wouldn't the level of human agency everywhere remain roughly constant pre and post colonization regardless of what happened? The only way I can make sense of this is if the writer assumes 'human agency' is some magical force that can overcome every other factor. "Diamond's account makes all the factors of European domination a product of a distant and accidental history" Assumes all 'factors' arose as a result of events in the distant past. Gunpowder, which was spread from China via the silk road, clearly and immediately was put to use fairly soon after the Spanish got hold of it, within a few generations. etc.
- mooreds 4y ago
  Thanks, I wasn't aware of the critiques!