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> The left says "no guns". The right says "more guns". The left actually says "more background checks", though there are an unreasonable group that goes for ab

> The left says "no guns". The right says "more guns". The left actually says "more background checks", though there are an unreasonable group that goes for absolutely no guns. There's also the questions about what to do with aftermarket triggers that allow for burst-firing or even fully-automatic firing, which are legal right now (and were used in the Las Vegas mass shooting attack). Banning certain items (ex: large-capacity magazines, trigger-mods, bump-stocks and the like) would still be an improvement.

koolba 4y ago
- dragontamer 4y ago
  Its not helpful to say "the left" or "the right". The important bit is that each item here is a legal issue. * Bump-stocks, yes or no? * Trigger-mods, yes or no? (Especially the ones with burst and/or automatic fire modes). * Magazines, what size should we ban? Is 10 bullets enough? 30 bullets? 100 bullets? * Should bullets be regulated in general? We regulate larger-capacity bullets (ex: 155mm artillery shells aren't exactly sold in the streets, nor are 30mm autocannons). So where do we draw the line there? Its not like mortars and grenade launchers are commonly available at gun stores. We have drawn the line and cutoff many kinds of weapons from normal use within this country. If we draw the line a bit more towards background-checks and removing the "automatic-weapons" (bump-stocks and trigger mods) from legality, that probably will help our country out.
  - koolba 4y ago
    I think all of those should be legal. Fully automatic weapons are already legal, they’re just insanely expensive (~$15K for a full auto machine gun) and require a bunch of NFA paperwork to take legal possession.
  - kevin_thibedeau 4y ago
    There are legitimate uses for light trigger actions to minimize disturbance from the finger pull. It isn't hard to bump fire such a gun if you hold it loosely. It would be nice to see the full auto mods to handguns made illegal and manufacturers were forced to modify their designs to impede them. There isn't a legitimate use for mag dumping such a weapon.
    - chroma 4y ago
      Auto sears are illegal. Possessing one is a felony with a penalty of up to 10 years in prison and a fine of $250,000. No legal civilian-owned full-auto firearm has been made since the 1986 ban.[1] There's really no way to make a semi-auto firearm that impedes full auto modification. Full auto is the default behavior. It's the trigger disconnector that makes a handgun semi-auto. That said, full auto isn't very useful. It's inaccurate and eats up ammo quickly, necessitating reloads. 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearm_Owners_Protection_Act#Ban_on_new_automatic_firearms https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearm_Owners_Protection_Act#...
      - qball 4y ago
        >Full auto is the default behavior. It's the trigger disconnector that makes a handgun semi-auto. This isn't true for any modern rifle or pistol design- the absence of the disconnector just means the gun stop working (hammer follow). You need additional parts to ensure that the gun works properly in full-auto; this is accomplished by a secondary trigger (the 'auto sear') that trips the hammer/striker after the bolt closes. >There's really no way to make a semi-auto firearm that impedes full auto modification. The only designs that work this way are all already classified as machine guns in the US, so they aren't made/sold there any more.
        chroma 4y ago
        Hammer follow can easily cause a gun to go full auto.[1] Yes it's not as reliable as a sear designed for full auto, but it can work surprisingly well on blowback actions. The original comment was about handguns specifically, and was likely a reference to auto sears on Glocks. The combination of striker-fired and reciprocating slide makes it very easy to trip the sear at the right time, giving you better reliability than simply disabling the disconnector. This tweet has a useful diagram showing how Glock auto sears work.[2] The ATF did restrict the manufacture of new guns that fire from an open bolt (since they are trivially made full-auto), but old open bolt guns aren't classified as machine guns. 1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qc2xpGQ_8w8&t=250s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qc2xpGQ_8w8&t=250s (just FYI this guy swears when his gun accidentally goes full auto) 2. https://twitter.com/keegan_hamilton/status/1507430901877129219 https://twitter.com/keegan_hamilton/status/15074309018771292...
Zak 4y ago
It is my understanding that bump stocks are currently treated as machine guns, which is to say almost impossible to legally own in the US. https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2018/12/26/2018-27763/bump-stock-type-devices https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2018/12/26/2018-27...
- dragontamer 4y ago
  https://news.bloomberglaw.com/white-collar-and-criminal-law/federal-bump-stock-ban-blocked-by-divided-appeals-court https://news.bloomberglaw.com/white-collar-and-criminal-law/... https://firearmslaw.duke.edu/2021/12/bump-stock-ban-heading-for-the-supreme-court-again/ https://firearmslaw.duke.edu/2021/12/bump-stock-ban-heading-... Bump-stocks remain a public political issue, likely heading to the Supreme Court.
  - Zak 4y ago
    It is no surprise that there's a legal challenge underway, but the Supreme Court has not granted certiorari and it is not clear that it will. https://www.scotusblog.com/case-files/cases/gun-owners-of-america-inc-v-garland/ https://www.scotusblog.com/case-files/cases/gun-owners-of-am...

koolba 4y ago

dragontamer 4y ago
Its not helpful to say "the left" or "the right". The important bit is that each item here is a legal issue. * Bump-stocks, yes or no? * Trigger-mods, yes or no? (Especially the ones with burst and/or automatic fire modes). * Magazines, what size should we ban? Is 10 bullets enough? 30 bullets? 100 bullets? * Should bullets be regulated in general? We regulate larger-capacity bullets (ex: 155mm artillery shells aren't exactly sold in the streets, nor are 30mm autocannons). So where do we draw the line there? Its not like mortars and grenade launchers are commonly available at gun stores. We have drawn the line and cutoff many kinds of weapons from normal use within this country. If we draw the line a bit more towards background-checks and removing the "automatic-weapons" (bump-stocks and trigger mods) from legality, that probably will help our country out.
- koolba 4y ago
  I think all of those should be legal. Fully automatic weapons are already legal, they’re just insanely expensive (~$15K for a full auto machine gun) and require a bunch of NFA paperwork to take legal possession.
- kevin_thibedeau 4y ago
  There are legitimate uses for light trigger actions to minimize disturbance from the finger pull. It isn't hard to bump fire such a gun if you hold it loosely. It would be nice to see the full auto mods to handguns made illegal and manufacturers were forced to modify their designs to impede them. There isn't a legitimate use for mag dumping such a weapon.
  - chroma 4y ago
    Auto sears are illegal. Possessing one is a felony with a penalty of up to 10 years in prison and a fine of $250,000. No legal civilian-owned full-auto firearm has been made since the 1986 ban.[1] There's really no way to make a semi-auto firearm that impedes full auto modification. Full auto is the default behavior. It's the trigger disconnector that makes a handgun semi-auto. That said, full auto isn't very useful. It's inaccurate and eats up ammo quickly, necessitating reloads. 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearm_Owners_Protection_Act#Ban_on_new_automatic_firearms https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearm_Owners_Protection_Act#...
    - qball 4y ago
      >Full auto is the default behavior. It's the trigger disconnector that makes a handgun semi-auto. This isn't true for any modern rifle or pistol design- the absence of the disconnector just means the gun stop working (hammer follow). You need additional parts to ensure that the gun works properly in full-auto; this is accomplished by a secondary trigger (the 'auto sear') that trips the hammer/striker after the bolt closes. >There's really no way to make a semi-auto firearm that impedes full auto modification. The only designs that work this way are all already classified as machine guns in the US, so they aren't made/sold there any more.
      - chroma 4y ago
        Hammer follow can easily cause a gun to go full auto.[1] Yes it's not as reliable as a sear designed for full auto, but it can work surprisingly well on blowback actions. The original comment was about handguns specifically, and was likely a reference to auto sears on Glocks. The combination of striker-fired and reciprocating slide makes it very easy to trip the sear at the right time, giving you better reliability than simply disabling the disconnector. This tweet has a useful diagram showing how Glock auto sears work.[2] The ATF did restrict the manufacture of new guns that fire from an open bolt (since they are trivially made full-auto), but old open bolt guns aren't classified as machine guns. 1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qc2xpGQ_8w8&t=250s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qc2xpGQ_8w8&t=250s (just FYI this guy swears when his gun accidentally goes full auto) 2. https://twitter.com/keegan_hamilton/status/1507430901877129219 https://twitter.com/keegan_hamilton/status/15074309018771292...

Zak 4y ago

It is my understanding that bump stocks are currently treated as machine guns, which is to say almost impossible to legally own in the US. https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2018/12/26/2018-27763/bump-stock-type-devices https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2018/12/26/2018-27...

dragontamer 4y ago
https://news.bloomberglaw.com/white-collar-and-criminal-law/federal-bump-stock-ban-blocked-by-divided-appeals-court https://news.bloomberglaw.com/white-collar-and-criminal-law/... https://firearmslaw.duke.edu/2021/12/bump-stock-ban-heading-for-the-supreme-court-again/ https://firearmslaw.duke.edu/2021/12/bump-stock-ban-heading-... Bump-stocks remain a public political issue, likely heading to the Supreme Court.
- Zak 4y ago
  It is no surprise that there's a legal challenge underway, but the Supreme Court has not granted certiorari and it is not clear that it will. https://www.scotusblog.com/case-files/cases/gun-owners-of-america-inc-v-garland/ https://www.scotusblog.com/case-files/cases/gun-owners-of-am...