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I called it ages ago -- this company is an utter train wreck. I am honestly ashamed of the entire industry for birthing and fostering this basically fraudulent

by aabhay 4y ago

I called it ages ago -- this company is an utter train wreck. I am honestly ashamed of the entire industry for birthing and fostering this basically fraudulent company. Its mistakes and lies are compounding on themselves, creating awful outcomes for its employees: - Company almost certainly juiced its usage numbers, potentially by buying users to inflate its customers revenues, so it could use those numbers to convince new customers - Used a single deal with a large company (Forever 21) to sell VCs on the vision, while under the hood that deal was clearly failing - ex CEO picked twitter fights constantly, to the point of calling into question whether he was even capable of focusing on execution - Biggest competitor (Fast) exploded even before the market crash. - Offered employees a four day work week while claiming rapid exponential growth - Offered employees PERSONALLY guaranteed loans to help them exercise the options - Raised at $11B valuation with 100x forward revenue multiples. - Cash raised is currently 6-8x revenue multiple, meaning valuation over next 12m makes employee options worthless - I've never seen the technology used on any website, and I am a frequent online shopper. Real talk, is this fin-tech's latest Theranos?

kumarm 4y ago
wouldn't Fast be the Theranos even by your description? Bolt definitely has some explaining todo with employee stock options but calling it Theranos seems little extreme.
- ergocoder 4y ago
  Not by a long shot. Fast didn't inflate their revenue. Bolt encouraged employees to take the loan to exercise stock. And Bolt's founder founded that loan company. Fast definitely didn't do that Calling it theranos seems fair...
- __derek__ 4y ago
  That seems right. Bolt : WeWork :: Fast : Theranos
nrmitchi 4y ago
> I've never seen the technology used on any website, and I am a frequent online shopper. I went down this rabbit hole last month. While not directly related to the current topic, it might help explain why you've "never seen it": https://twitter.com/nrmitchi/status/1519174682863226880 https://twitter.com/nrmitchi/status/1519174682863226880
- ev1 4y ago
  Anecdotally, I keep a very tight list of domains that run with default third party blocked JS, and am very picky on uBlock. I have never seen a single site using Fast or Bolt.
- tomcam 4y ago
  Great thread. Be nice if journalists could manage that level of sophistication.
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pevey 4y ago
I have an ecommerce web site for a smallish regional coffee company I own. I heard about Bolt and was interested enough to go to their web site to learn more. Could not find a pricing page. Saw a form where you can request a demo. Realized it was one of those products. Left immediately. I don't have time for that song and dance. No wonder they can't grow market share.
- hn_throwaway_99 4y ago
  > Realized it was one of those products. A product not intended for an SMB, but instead one targeted at large enterprises?
  - lazide 4y ago
    A product that may not even exist? Or require your own engineering team to make work?
    - ryanSrich 4y ago
      Eh. Plenty of enterprise deals require services for implementation. None of this is shady. It’s incredibly common for sites to not have pricing. I wouldn’t chalk any of these up to Bolt being a mess. Their numbers and their founder does that for them already.
hackernewds 4y ago
Can only prop up the scam for so long. Here are some good reads: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/05/10/business/bolt-start-up-ryan-breslow-investors.html https://www.nytimes.com/2022/05/10/business/bolt-start-up-ry... and ICYMI the infamous "Stripe and YCombinator, the Mob Bosses of Silicon Valley" thread from the soon-to-be-former CEO: https://twitter.com/theryanking/status/1485784823641755648 https://twitter.com/theryanking/status/1485784823641755648 if it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, quacks like a duck...

by aabhay 4y ago

kumarm 4y ago

wouldn't Fast be the Theranos even by your description? Bolt definitely has some explaining todo with employee stock options but calling it Theranos seems little extreme.

ergocoder 4y ago
Not by a long shot. Fast didn't inflate their revenue. Bolt encouraged employees to take the loan to exercise stock. And Bolt's founder founded that loan company. Fast definitely didn't do that Calling it theranos seems fair...
__derek__ 4y ago
That seems right. Bolt : WeWork :: Fast : Theranos

nrmitchi 4y ago

> I've never seen the technology used on any website, and I am a frequent online shopper. I went down this rabbit hole last month. While not directly related to the current topic, it might help explain why you've "never seen it": https://twitter.com/nrmitchi/status/1519174682863226880 https://twitter.com/nrmitchi/status/1519174682863226880

ev1 4y ago
Anecdotally, I keep a very tight list of domains that run with default third party blocked JS, and am very picky on uBlock. I have never seen a single site using Fast or Bolt.
tomcam 4y ago
Great thread. Be nice if journalists could manage that level of sophistication.

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pevey 4y ago

I have an ecommerce web site for a smallish regional coffee company I own. I heard about Bolt and was interested enough to go to their web site to learn more. Could not find a pricing page. Saw a form where you can request a demo. Realized it was one of those products. Left immediately. I don't have time for that song and dance. No wonder they can't grow market share.

hn_throwaway_99 4y ago
> Realized it was one of those products. A product not intended for an SMB, but instead one targeted at large enterprises?
- lazide 4y ago
  A product that may not even exist? Or require your own engineering team to make work?
  - ryanSrich 4y ago
    Eh. Plenty of enterprise deals require services for implementation. None of this is shady. It’s incredibly common for sites to not have pricing. I wouldn’t chalk any of these up to Bolt being a mess. Their numbers and their founder does that for them already.

hackernewds 4y ago

Can only prop up the scam for so long. Here are some good reads: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/05/10/business/bolt-start-up-ryan-breslow-investors.html https://www.nytimes.com/2022/05/10/business/bolt-start-up-ry... and ICYMI the infamous "Stripe and YCombinator, the Mob Bosses of Silicon Valley" thread from the soon-to-be-former CEO: https://twitter.com/theryanking/status/1485784823641755648 https://twitter.com/theryanking/status/1485784823641755648 if it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, quacks like a duck...