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The underlying issue is that online political or social discourse isn't so much as discourse as much as the virtual form of people trying to fit in socially - p

The underlying issue is that online political or social discourse isn't so much as discourse as much as the virtual form of people trying to fit in socially - people use political/social issues to signal what kind of person they are (or more accurately, what kind of person they want everyone else to think they are), in order to feel like they are part of a community. Once you understand the online social media through this lens, everything is easily explained, from how people converse and decide to ostracize people who don't agree right from the get go, to how websites are designed to drive user engagement.

ertian 4y ago
On top of that, and related: almost no conversations are private or intimate. Conversations have a vast potential audience. So people are less concerned with communicating their point or changing the mind of the person to whom they're speaking; instead, the goal is often to impress points on the implicit audience. That leads to a sort of competition for 'audience' mindshare, where conceding a point or acknowledging complexity feels like giving ground to the other side. In other words, it's not just about tribalism and a sense of belonging, it's also about lobbying for the positions and attitudes you hold and pushing out those you disagree with. You don't actually care much about the specific person you're talking to: you're performing for an audience. In a sense, we've all become politicians.
- MichaelZuo 4y ago
  Only among the population vying for social status.
  - ertian 4y ago
    I don't think so. I'm not particularly interested in 'status', but I do want to propagate my opinions. When I'm replying to a comment online--like this one--I'm not really thinking of changing your opinion. I'm thinking how other people are going to read our comments, and what opinions they're coming away with. I don't care what they think of me, or of you, but I care what ideas propagate. Unfortunately, that undermines our conversation.
    - MichaelZuo 4y ago
      Propagating your opinion to other people counts. If you try to propagate it to inert objects like rocks then it wouldn’t.

ertian 4y ago

On top of that, and related: almost no conversations are private or intimate. Conversations have a vast potential audience. So people are less concerned with communicating their point or changing the mind of the person to whom they're speaking; instead, the goal is often to impress points on the implicit audience. That leads to a sort of competition for 'audience' mindshare, where conceding a point or acknowledging complexity feels like giving ground to the other side. In other words, it's not just about tribalism and a sense of belonging, it's also about lobbying for the positions and attitudes you hold and pushing out those you disagree with. You don't actually care much about the specific person you're talking to: you're performing for an audience. In a sense, we've all become politicians.

MichaelZuo 4y ago
Only among the population vying for social status.
- ertian 4y ago
  I don't think so. I'm not particularly interested in 'status', but I do want to propagate my opinions. When I'm replying to a comment online--like this one--I'm not really thinking of changing your opinion. I'm thinking how other people are going to read our comments, and what opinions they're coming away with. I don't care what they think of me, or of you, but I care what ideas propagate. Unfortunately, that undermines our conversation.
  - MichaelZuo 4y ago
    Propagating your opinion to other people counts. If you try to propagate it to inert objects like rocks then it wouldn’t.