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> And what do you know, just in time for them to gain unopposable, unaccountable ability to lock down the entire world whenever they want Who benefits from 'lo

> And what do you know, just in time for them to gain unopposable, unaccountable ability to lock down the entire world whenever they want Who benefits from 'lockdowns'? The economy slows down, workers stop working and lining up powerful people's pockets. Tourism plummets, supply chains gets disrupted. It's not profitable. Even a war brings profits. Lockdowns don't. Mind you, most countries didn't experience any lockdowns at all. Not every organization is conspiring against you. If anything, the media was regularly pushing to reopen business even as hospitals struggle.

codefreeordie 4y ago
Worldwide wealth and power dramatically consolidated to the not-locked-down class during the lockdowns. It's very hard to rule over well-off, free people who have the ability to get together in groups and converse. It is very easy to rule over isolated, poor, desperate people who can't communicate with each other without using the controlled platforms on which unapproved speech is impermissible.
- outworlder 4y ago
  > It's very hard to rule over well-off, free people who have the ability to get together in groups and converse. We don't need to physically congregate anymore to 'converse'. Exhibit A: what we are doing here. We are long past the time when this sort of measure would be effective to contain ideas. > It is very easy to rule over isolated, poor, desperate people who can't communicate with each other without using the controlled platforms on which unapproved speech is impermissible. That's not a slippery slope anymore, it's a inertialess elevator. Having the power to stop local transmission quickly before it gets out of control != turning people into isolated and poor communities.
  - codefreeordie 4y ago
    this communication channel is heavily censored, as evidenced by the fact that I've lost almost all of my karma (which is required to be able to speak) by having this conversation. I can only afford to speak three or four more times, and then dang and his crew will have finished silencing me for disagreement with the mandatory narrative. edit since I'm not allowed to reply to you anymore, apparently: Agreement with the narrative produces upvotes, increased karma. Disagreement is punished. On this channel, it tends to take longer to get silenced than on the more popular ones (post on facebook or twitter anything that goes against the obligatory viewpoint and your account will be shadowbanned or actually banned more or less instantly. Here, so long as you agree with the narrative more often than you oppose the narrative, you still can occasionally post -- though as you get downvotes (which only pro-narrative users can hand out) your messages disappear, leaving ... only the pro-narrative message visible. This makes organizing to oppose the narrative nearly impossible. Look at the large counter-narrative groups. Their numbers were decimated by the lockdowns. They pretty much only exist in the few states that decided to end the lockdowns. Now that covid doesn't scare people into obedience anymore, there is the possible for organization again, which is why a new threat is required. Anyway, I'm out. Dang's crew has effectively silenced me on the subject, because I am no longer willing to pay to be allowed to disagree with his mandatory narrative. It's really easy to chill speech, it turns out.
    - gus_massa 4y ago
      You still have 386 karma, and after -4 the other downvotes don't change your karma. Is that a total of -5? So you can still post more than 70 times, and get heavily donwvoted, and still have positive karma. IIRC you can still post with negative karma. It's unusual, but I think it's possible. Dang may still decide to ban you, even if you have positive karma. It's usually due to personal aggressions or lot of silly oneliners. I don't see anything like that in your comment history, but I didn't check too much.
walterbell 4y ago
Who benefits from 'lockdowns'? https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/justice-department/biggest-fraud-generation-looting-covid-relief-program-known-ppp-n1279664 https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/justice-department/biggest-... > 'Biggest fraud in a generation': The looting of the Covid relief plan known as PPP ... the theft of as much as $80 billion — or about 10 percent — of the $800 billion handed out in a Covid relief plan known as the Paycheck Protection Program, or PPP. That’s on top of the $90 billion to $400 billion believed to have been stolen from the $900 billion Covid unemployment relief program — at least half taken by international fraudsters ... And another $80 billion potentially pilfered from a separate Covid disaster relief program.
- outworlder 4y ago
  While we are at it, we can say that mask manufacturers benefit. And morgues, I guess. That's not what I meant and you know it. Here's the thing though - it's not sustainable. The entire world is either in a recession or trying their best to not be in one. Inflation is rampant globally. Supply chains have been disrupted. We can't have nonstop pandemics.
  - walterbell 4y ago
    > Inflation is rampant globally Inflation is partially due to trillions printed during the pandemic. Lockdowns created deflation, temporarily hiding the consequences of money printing. > We can't have nonstop pandemics. There's a difference between "foo" and "threat of foo". The latter can last for a long time, e.g. airport security procedures implemented in response to one-time events, still in effect twenty years later, with little evidence of effectiveness.
  - codefreeordie 4y ago
    The common people are in a recession. The folks at Davos this week, or the people at the top of the governments are enjoying the greatest degree of power and wealth in history. You and I can't afford to do the things we could afford to do pre-pandemic, but the Davos set have more wealth and more uncontested power.

codefreeordie 4y ago

Worldwide wealth and power dramatically consolidated to the not-locked-down class during the lockdowns. It's very hard to rule over well-off, free people who have the ability to get together in groups and converse. It is very easy to rule over isolated, poor, desperate people who can't communicate with each other without using the controlled platforms on which unapproved speech is impermissible.

outworlder 4y ago
> It's very hard to rule over well-off, free people who have the ability to get together in groups and converse. We don't need to physically congregate anymore to 'converse'. Exhibit A: what we are doing here. We are long past the time when this sort of measure would be effective to contain ideas. > It is very easy to rule over isolated, poor, desperate people who can't communicate with each other without using the controlled platforms on which unapproved speech is impermissible. That's not a slippery slope anymore, it's a inertialess elevator. Having the power to stop local transmission quickly before it gets out of control != turning people into isolated and poor communities.
- codefreeordie 4y ago
  this communication channel is heavily censored, as evidenced by the fact that I've lost almost all of my karma (which is required to be able to speak) by having this conversation. I can only afford to speak three or four more times, and then dang and his crew will have finished silencing me for disagreement with the mandatory narrative. edit since I'm not allowed to reply to you anymore, apparently: Agreement with the narrative produces upvotes, increased karma. Disagreement is punished. On this channel, it tends to take longer to get silenced than on the more popular ones (post on facebook or twitter anything that goes against the obligatory viewpoint and your account will be shadowbanned or actually banned more or less instantly. Here, so long as you agree with the narrative more often than you oppose the narrative, you still can occasionally post -- though as you get downvotes (which only pro-narrative users can hand out) your messages disappear, leaving ... only the pro-narrative message visible. This makes organizing to oppose the narrative nearly impossible. Look at the large counter-narrative groups. Their numbers were decimated by the lockdowns. They pretty much only exist in the few states that decided to end the lockdowns. Now that covid doesn't scare people into obedience anymore, there is the possible for organization again, which is why a new threat is required. Anyway, I'm out. Dang's crew has effectively silenced me on the subject, because I am no longer willing to pay to be allowed to disagree with his mandatory narrative. It's really easy to chill speech, it turns out.
  - gus_massa 4y ago
    You still have 386 karma, and after -4 the other downvotes don't change your karma. Is that a total of -5? So you can still post more than 70 times, and get heavily donwvoted, and still have positive karma. IIRC you can still post with negative karma. It's unusual, but I think it's possible. Dang may still decide to ban you, even if you have positive karma. It's usually due to personal aggressions or lot of silly oneliners. I don't see anything like that in your comment history, but I didn't check too much.

walterbell 4y ago

Who benefits from 'lockdowns'? https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/justice-department/biggest-fraud-generation-looting-covid-relief-program-known-ppp-n1279664 https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/justice-department/biggest-... > 'Biggest fraud in a generation': The looting of the Covid relief plan known as PPP ... the theft of as much as $80 billion — or about 10 percent — of the $800 billion handed out in a Covid relief plan known as the Paycheck Protection Program, or PPP. That’s on top of the $90 billion to $400 billion believed to have been stolen from the $900 billion Covid unemployment relief program — at least half taken by international fraudsters ... And another $80 billion potentially pilfered from a separate Covid disaster relief program.

outworlder 4y ago
While we are at it, we can say that mask manufacturers benefit. And morgues, I guess. That's not what I meant and you know it. Here's the thing though - it's not sustainable. The entire world is either in a recession or trying their best to not be in one. Inflation is rampant globally. Supply chains have been disrupted. We can't have nonstop pandemics.
- walterbell 4y ago
  > Inflation is rampant globally Inflation is partially due to trillions printed during the pandemic. Lockdowns created deflation, temporarily hiding the consequences of money printing. > We can't have nonstop pandemics. There's a difference between "foo" and "threat of foo". The latter can last for a long time, e.g. airport security procedures implemented in response to one-time events, still in effect twenty years later, with little evidence of effectiveness.
- codefreeordie 4y ago
  The common people are in a recession. The folks at Davos this week, or the people at the top of the governments are enjoying the greatest degree of power and wealth in history. You and I can't afford to do the things we could afford to do pre-pandemic, but the Davos set have more wealth and more uncontested power.