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Society has decided that it doesn't want to support American universities through tax dollars [1] so you can't really blame universities for trying to find any

Society has decided that it doesn't want to support American universities through tax dollars [1] so you can't really blame universities for trying to find any and all other sources of funding. [1] https://www.cbpp.org/research/state-budget-and-tax/state-higher-education-funding-cuts-have-pushed-costs-to-students https://www.cbpp.org/research/state-budget-and-tax/state-hig...

newsclues 4y ago
What about tuition? Or monetize research instead of gifting it to large (pharmaceutical) companies? This isn’t the only way for education to fund itself, and the incentives are not aligned with the mission.
- pkaye 4y ago
  In terms of drug research the value of the discovery rises only after the clinical trials are complete.
  - newsclues 4y ago
    In terms of software services, all the code does nothing until it’s deployed. Should schools develop software and the pass the code off to Microsoft or Oracle to deploy it on their servers? A university couldn’t possibly do it themselves, not without giving away billions to industry!!!
engineeringwoke 4y ago
Providing education isn't expensive; big campuses and teams of administrators are. Universities could easily return to the old ways, just cap annual loans at $20k per head. It would be painful, but they're fat, and what they're doing is bad for society.
- brtkdotse 4y ago
  Not to mention sports teams.
  - Sohcahtoa82 4y ago
    Sports teams are a profit center. Season tickets are hundreds or even a thousand dollars. And then there's the absurd money they make at the concession stands and merchandising.
  - uberman 4y ago
    You don't understand university sports revenues and expenses. Feel free to download a breakdown of revenues and expenses for the university of your choice at: https://ope.ed.gov/athletics/#/ https://ope.ed.gov/athletics/#/ You are going to find that almost every school is net neutral with respect to their sports programs. Football and basketball typically funding all other sports.
    - flaviut 4y ago
      I haven't looked at the entire dataset, but looking at the major schools that are close to me: Expenses: 12M, 25M, 13M, 70M Revenue: 6M, 30M, 13M, 44M 1/4 is making a slight profit. 1/4 is breaking even. 2/4 are making a major loss. A Kennesaw State University (00157700 )| Total Enrollment: 27,300 B Georgia Institute of Technology-Main Campus | Total Enrollment: 14,476 C Georgia State University | Total Enrollment: 22,276 D University of Georgia | Total Enrollment: 27,877
      - cudgy 4y ago
        These figures don’t add up: “University of Georgia Athletics approved a new budget for the 2022 fiscal year on Friday. The budget is set at $150,290,994, which is $7.7 million more than in 2019 and $3 million short of the 2020 budget. Georgia athletic director Josh Brooks told media that the 2020 budget shortfall is currently $30 million and was previously $53 million amid the COVID-19 pandemic.” https://ugawire.usatoday.com/2021/05/28/georgia-foootball-uga-athletics-reveals-huge-budget-2021/ https://ugawire.usatoday.com/2021/05/28/georgia-foootball-ug... Later in the article, it states that the stadiums were at partial capacity (mid 2021), so once stadiums went back to full capacity revenue surely increase significantly.
BitwiseFool 4y ago
>"Society has decided that it doesn't want to support American universities through tax dollars." This is hyperbole, the government is spending billions on American Universities in a myriad of different ways. And, many ways of support are not direct. One could argue that the guaranteed student loan programs are a roundabout way of supporting universities through tax dollars as well.
- lotsofpulp 4y ago
  > One could argue that the guaranteed student loan programs are a roundabout way of supporting universities through tax dollars as well. No, guaranteed student loans are a way to transfer wealth from future taxpayers and borrowers to beneficiaries of tuition such as university staff and whoever is receiving money from the university such as construction companies and whatnot. The guaranteed loans with no underwriting obfuscate costs and thus result in a mid allocation of society’s resources. Such as leagues of people spending their valuable years learning “communications” or “business” degrees and then sitting in a call center or other role that does not pay enough to make the degree they paid for in time and money to have any decent or even positive ROI.

newsclues 4y ago

What about tuition? Or monetize research instead of gifting it to large (pharmaceutical) companies? This isn’t the only way for education to fund itself, and the incentives are not aligned with the mission.

pkaye 4y ago
In terms of drug research the value of the discovery rises only after the clinical trials are complete.
- newsclues 4y ago
  In terms of software services, all the code does nothing until it’s deployed. Should schools develop software and the pass the code off to Microsoft or Oracle to deploy it on their servers? A university couldn’t possibly do it themselves, not without giving away billions to industry!!!

engineeringwoke 4y ago

Providing education isn't expensive; big campuses and teams of administrators are. Universities could easily return to the old ways, just cap annual loans at $20k per head. It would be painful, but they're fat, and what they're doing is bad for society.

brtkdotse 4y ago
Not to mention sports teams.
- Sohcahtoa82 4y ago
  Sports teams are a profit center. Season tickets are hundreds or even a thousand dollars. And then there's the absurd money they make at the concession stands and merchandising.
- uberman 4y ago
  You don't understand university sports revenues and expenses. Feel free to download a breakdown of revenues and expenses for the university of your choice at: https://ope.ed.gov/athletics/#/ https://ope.ed.gov/athletics/#/ You are going to find that almost every school is net neutral with respect to their sports programs. Football and basketball typically funding all other sports.
  - flaviut 4y ago
    I haven't looked at the entire dataset, but looking at the major schools that are close to me: Expenses: 12M, 25M, 13M, 70M Revenue: 6M, 30M, 13M, 44M 1/4 is making a slight profit. 1/4 is breaking even. 2/4 are making a major loss. A Kennesaw State University (00157700 )| Total Enrollment: 27,300 B Georgia Institute of Technology-Main Campus | Total Enrollment: 14,476 C Georgia State University | Total Enrollment: 22,276 D University of Georgia | Total Enrollment: 27,877
    - cudgy 4y ago
      These figures don’t add up: “University of Georgia Athletics approved a new budget for the 2022 fiscal year on Friday. The budget is set at $150,290,994, which is $7.7 million more than in 2019 and $3 million short of the 2020 budget. Georgia athletic director Josh Brooks told media that the 2020 budget shortfall is currently $30 million and was previously $53 million amid the COVID-19 pandemic.” https://ugawire.usatoday.com/2021/05/28/georgia-foootball-uga-athletics-reveals-huge-budget-2021/ https://ugawire.usatoday.com/2021/05/28/georgia-foootball-ug... Later in the article, it states that the stadiums were at partial capacity (mid 2021), so once stadiums went back to full capacity revenue surely increase significantly.

BitwiseFool 4y ago

>"Society has decided that it doesn't want to support American universities through tax dollars." This is hyperbole, the government is spending billions on American Universities in a myriad of different ways. And, many ways of support are not direct. One could argue that the guaranteed student loan programs are a roundabout way of supporting universities through tax dollars as well.

lotsofpulp 4y ago
> One could argue that the guaranteed student loan programs are a roundabout way of supporting universities through tax dollars as well. No, guaranteed student loans are a way to transfer wealth from future taxpayers and borrowers to beneficiaries of tuition such as university staff and whoever is receiving money from the university such as construction companies and whatnot. The guaranteed loans with no underwriting obfuscate costs and thus result in a mid allocation of society’s resources. Such as leagues of people spending their valuable years learning “communications” or “business” degrees and then sitting in a call center or other role that does not pay enough to make the degree they paid for in time and money to have any decent or even positive ROI.