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I think Apple has proven it can maintain the premium cachet [1], making healthy profits as well as offering competitive pricing. It has sold more than 300 milli

I think Apple has proven it can maintain the premium cachet [1], making healthy profits as well as offering competitive pricing. It has sold more than 300 million iPods, and yet, they look and feel like luxury products. Also, it is only through Intel's $300 million stimulus fund [2] that computer manufacturers other than Apple have finally started making slim notebooks that can compete with MacBook Air on price. Whether they can actually compete on quality remains to be seen, the 'ultrabooks' haven't exactly gotten favorable reviews. Read for instance Engadget's review of the Acer Aspire S3, their conclusion is "If you absolutely must buy a laptop of this ilk right now, you'll get better performance and longer battery life from the MacBook Air" [3]. [1] http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/cachet http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/cachet [2] http://newsroom.intel.com/community/intel_newsroom/blog/2011/08/10/intel-capital-creates-300-million-ultrabook-fund http://newsroom.intel.com/community/intel_newsroom/blog/2011... [3] http://www.engadget.com/2011/10/14/acer-aspire-s3-ultrabook-review/ http://www.engadget.com/2011/10/14/acer-aspire-s3-ultrabook-...

pedalpete 15y ago
Sorry about the spelling on cachet, I was wondering about that. I'm not sure if you intentionally left out the review of the UX31, or just were unaware of Engadgets positive review yesterday. http://www.engadget.com/2011/10/21/asus-zenbook-ux31-review/ http://www.engadget.com/2011/10/21/asus-zenbook-ux31-review/ My biggest disappointment with all of these 'ultrabooks' is that they are MacBook Air clones. I don't think PC makers are going to go very far competing with Apple by copying their designs. PC makers need to start innovating themselves. Ultrabook is starting to be a synonym for MacBook copy, but there is a great opportunity to create products like the Lenovo U260 (which I'm typing this on now) which are as light as the Air, with warmer materials and don't have the wedge shape.
- Samuel_Michon 15y ago
  I hadn't read Engadget's review of the Asus Zenbook. I have now, and I also read the review at Anandtech [1]. Both sites really try hard to like the device, but they agree on several points: - incoherent case design (did you see that blue USB port?) - uncomfortable keyboard with barely any travel - trackpad is laggy and inaccurate - display is TN, not IPS, and has high black levels. Anandtech's conclusion: "if you don't care about OS X and just want a good, ultra-thin Windows machine the Zenbook is a viable alternative. If ASUS can fix the trackpad issues then it's worth considering, however the display in the MBA alone is reason to opt for it over the Zenbook, even for Windows use" [1] http://www.anandtech.com/show/4985/asus-zenbook-ux21-review/1 http://www.anandtech.com/show/4985/asus-zenbook-ux21-review/...
  - robin_reala 15y ago
    To be fair, blue USB port = USB3 port in PC parlance. No excuse for the trackpad though.
- usaar333 15y ago
  For a pretty innovative, awesome laptop (arguably the best ultraportable out there), see Sony Vaio Z (http://www.anandtech.com/show/4474/sony-updates-vaio-z-thinner-lighter-light-peak-and-external-gpu http://www.anandtech.com/show/4474/sony-updates-vaio-z-thinn...). Only super lightweight ultra-portable desktop replacement I know of.
  - Samuel_Michon 15y ago
    It also costs $700 more than a comparable MacBook Air.
usaar333 15y ago
Seems Intel launched the stimulus just a few months ago; has it flowed to companies already? Question I couldn't find through searching. Assuming weight is constant, what are the pros of ultra-thinness that outweigh the lack of upgradability?
- Samuel_Michon 15y ago
  Intel announced their ultra book initiative at Computex, on May 31st. At the time, only Asus showed a concept. On September 6th, Intel announced its stimulus package. Suddenly, shortly after, several other manufacturers showed interest. The first ultrabooks started shipping this month. I don't think it's far-fetched to say that the stimulus had something to do with that. Assuming weight is constant, what are the pros of ultra-thinness that outweigh the lack of upgradability? I'm not sure I understand the question. A thinner notebook usually makes for a lighter notebook. If a 'regular' notebook does weigh as little as an ultrabook, it's probably made of cheap plastic -- one of the characteristics of a MacBook Air is its rigid unibody aluminum frame. Besides, the difference in upgradability between a MacBook Air and a MacBook Pro is negligible (storage, RAM and battery are not user serviceable on either of those machines).
  - usaar333 15y ago
    The context for thinness was comparing it to other laptops brought up in this thread (I mentioned the Toshiba Portege a lot). The 13" Macbook Air is ~3 lbs, within 10% of tons of other laptops. So coming back to Intel, you mentioned they are making a fund for PC makers to be competitive. On my end, I've been using a 3.3 lbs (10% heavier than Air though 60% thicker) Latitude E4300 since mid-2009 that cost me far less than an Air would then - I certainly consider it a competitor to the Air. Would you not consider it as such?
    - Samuel_Michon 15y ago
      "The context for thinness was comparing it to other laptops brought up in this thread (I mentioned the Toshiba Portege a lot). The 13" Macbook Air is ~3 lbs, within 10% of tons of other laptops." As I mentioned earlier, if a notebook is light but bulky, the build quality probably isn't great. "On my end, I've been using a 3.3 lbs (10% heavier than Air though 60% thicker) Latitude E4300 since mid-2009 that cost me far less than an Air would then" You want to compare your 2 year old notebook to a 2 year old MacBook Air? Even though the MacBook Air has become even more affordable since and the E4300 doesn't even exist anymore? Alright. The Latitude E4300 with 64GB SSD cost $2600 [1]. The MacBook Air with 128GB SSD cost $1800 [2]. "I certainly consider it a competitor to the Air. Would you not consider it as such?" Together with the Sony VAIO Z and the Lenovo X301, those were the only notebooks at that time that came anywhere close to the MacBook Air. That doesn't mean it qualifies as a competitor in 2011. The E4300 weighs 3.3 lbs and is 1.1" thick. The MacBook Air weighs 2.96 lbs and is 0.11-0.68" thick. That means the E4300 has more than twice as much mass; it might be ultra-light but it's definitely not ultra-portable according to today's standards. [1] http://www.laptopmag.com/review/laptops/dell-latitude-e4300.aspx http://www.laptopmag.com/review/laptops/dell-latitude-e4300.... [2] http://www.everymac.com/systems/apple/macbook-air/stats/macbook-air-core-2-duo-2.13-13-mid-2009-specs.html http://www.everymac.com/systems/apple/macbook-air/stats/macb...

pedalpete 15y ago

Sorry about the spelling on cachet, I was wondering about that. I'm not sure if you intentionally left out the review of the UX31, or just were unaware of Engadgets positive review yesterday. http://www.engadget.com/2011/10/21/asus-zenbook-ux31-review/ http://www.engadget.com/2011/10/21/asus-zenbook-ux31-review/ My biggest disappointment with all of these 'ultrabooks' is that they are MacBook Air clones. I don't think PC makers are going to go very far competing with Apple by copying their designs. PC makers need to start innovating themselves. Ultrabook is starting to be a synonym for MacBook copy, but there is a great opportunity to create products like the Lenovo U260 (which I'm typing this on now) which are as light as the Air, with warmer materials and don't have the wedge shape.

Samuel_Michon 15y ago
I hadn't read Engadget's review of the Asus Zenbook. I have now, and I also read the review at Anandtech [1]. Both sites really try hard to like the device, but they agree on several points: - incoherent case design (did you see that blue USB port?) - uncomfortable keyboard with barely any travel - trackpad is laggy and inaccurate - display is TN, not IPS, and has high black levels. Anandtech's conclusion: "if you don't care about OS X and just want a good, ultra-thin Windows machine the Zenbook is a viable alternative. If ASUS can fix the trackpad issues then it's worth considering, however the display in the MBA alone is reason to opt for it over the Zenbook, even for Windows use" [1] http://www.anandtech.com/show/4985/asus-zenbook-ux21-review/1 http://www.anandtech.com/show/4985/asus-zenbook-ux21-review/...
- robin_reala 15y ago
  To be fair, blue USB port = USB3 port in PC parlance. No excuse for the trackpad though.
usaar333 15y ago
For a pretty innovative, awesome laptop (arguably the best ultraportable out there), see Sony Vaio Z (http://www.anandtech.com/show/4474/sony-updates-vaio-z-thinner-lighter-light-peak-and-external-gpu http://www.anandtech.com/show/4474/sony-updates-vaio-z-thinn...). Only super lightweight ultra-portable desktop replacement I know of.
- Samuel_Michon 15y ago
  It also costs $700 more than a comparable MacBook Air.

usaar333 15y ago

Seems Intel launched the stimulus just a few months ago; has it flowed to companies already? Question I couldn't find through searching. Assuming weight is constant, what are the pros of ultra-thinness that outweigh the lack of upgradability?

Samuel_Michon 15y ago
Intel announced their ultra book initiative at Computex, on May 31st. At the time, only Asus showed a concept. On September 6th, Intel announced its stimulus package. Suddenly, shortly after, several other manufacturers showed interest. The first ultrabooks started shipping this month. I don't think it's far-fetched to say that the stimulus had something to do with that. Assuming weight is constant, what are the pros of ultra-thinness that outweigh the lack of upgradability? I'm not sure I understand the question. A thinner notebook usually makes for a lighter notebook. If a 'regular' notebook does weigh as little as an ultrabook, it's probably made of cheap plastic -- one of the characteristics of a MacBook Air is its rigid unibody aluminum frame. Besides, the difference in upgradability between a MacBook Air and a MacBook Pro is negligible (storage, RAM and battery are not user serviceable on either of those machines).
- usaar333 15y ago
  The context for thinness was comparing it to other laptops brought up in this thread (I mentioned the Toshiba Portege a lot). The 13" Macbook Air is ~3 lbs, within 10% of tons of other laptops. So coming back to Intel, you mentioned they are making a fund for PC makers to be competitive. On my end, I've been using a 3.3 lbs (10% heavier than Air though 60% thicker) Latitude E4300 since mid-2009 that cost me far less than an Air would then - I certainly consider it a competitor to the Air. Would you not consider it as such?
  - Samuel_Michon 15y ago
    "The context for thinness was comparing it to other laptops brought up in this thread (I mentioned the Toshiba Portege a lot). The 13" Macbook Air is ~3 lbs, within 10% of tons of other laptops." As I mentioned earlier, if a notebook is light but bulky, the build quality probably isn't great. "On my end, I've been using a 3.3 lbs (10% heavier than Air though 60% thicker) Latitude E4300 since mid-2009 that cost me far less than an Air would then" You want to compare your 2 year old notebook to a 2 year old MacBook Air? Even though the MacBook Air has become even more affordable since and the E4300 doesn't even exist anymore? Alright. The Latitude E4300 with 64GB SSD cost $2600 [1]. The MacBook Air with 128GB SSD cost $1800 [2]. "I certainly consider it a competitor to the Air. Would you not consider it as such?" Together with the Sony VAIO Z and the Lenovo X301, those were the only notebooks at that time that came anywhere close to the MacBook Air. That doesn't mean it qualifies as a competitor in 2011. The E4300 weighs 3.3 lbs and is 1.1" thick. The MacBook Air weighs 2.96 lbs and is 0.11-0.68" thick. That means the E4300 has more than twice as much mass; it might be ultra-light but it's definitely not ultra-portable according to today's standards. [1] http://www.laptopmag.com/review/laptops/dell-latitude-e4300.aspx http://www.laptopmag.com/review/laptops/dell-latitude-e4300.... [2] http://www.everymac.com/systems/apple/macbook-air/stats/macbook-air-core-2-duo-2.13-13-mid-2009-specs.html http://www.everymac.com/systems/apple/macbook-air/stats/macb...