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> There’s a certain phenomenon I often wonder about, one that only seems to occur with culture war topics. I mean, the term "culture war" itself is part of the

by xg15 4y ago

> There’s a certain phenomenon I often wonder about, one that only seems to occur with culture war topics. I mean, the term "culture war" itself is part of the "conservative" vocabulary in that issue. So I can see why the whole thing is not easy.

colordrops 4y ago
That's your own characterization, and not universal. I've personally seen the term more often in non-conservative forums and circles. Not that it matters to your point, which I get and agree with.
- r2_pilot 4y ago
  Regarding this phenomenon, it may be that you don't see that term in conservative forums because they don't want to use it, whether because it telegraphs their intent or they don't want to use the same words as liberals (this increasingly drastic polarization of language is a key point of Lingua Tertii Imperii... A book I started reading before 2015 and had to quit reading because frankly it bothered me how much it started to resemble current times in the US). So its absence isn't altogether surprising.
- dgb23 4y ago
  They probably meant historically. If I remember correctly it was coined as a part of a wider strategy decades ago. Of course, it is a catchy term and is being used widely now. Similarly the term political correctness was initially a term used in jest by the left I think.
DocTomoe 4y ago
The term originated in the German "Kulturkampf", which was between the Imperial German state of the 1870s and the Catholic Church. In the US, it was introduced twice, neither time by conservatives.
MockObject 4y ago
The culture war is so profound, we can't even agree on whether it's a culture war or not.
lazide 4y ago
Personally I use it because it’s descriptive. Hard lines being drawn, people unwilling to even talk with others based on ideological labels, economic sanctions against ‘offenders’, propaganda clearly targeted at specific identifiable groups used to raise funds and attack the ‘other’ side, fear and loathing/us vs them. I have an aunt who for economic reasons moved to what she called ‘Trump country’, and she legitimately feared for her life. She got death threats on Facebook when she tried to argue with some of her neighbors on ideological lines. She fell and hurt herself really badly, and everyone pitched in and has been helping her recover though. I haven’t seen it used much anywhere else with any regularity, but I have no interest in following any propaganda outlets anywhere and gave up regularly reading any news 6 months or so ago.
- riskable 4y ago
  > Hard lines being drawn, people unwilling to even talk with others based on ideological labels, economic sanctions against ‘offenders’, propaganda clearly targeted at specific identifiable groups used to raise funds and attack the ‘other’ side, fear and loathing/us vs them. You're describing today's conservatives. Liberals seem to be always willing to entertain the discussion of basically anything. It's sort of a core tenet of liberalism... Open discussion and debate. Where liberals shut discussions down is when they ask for evidence or at least sound reasoning and aren't presented with anything. That's the logical point where you can't really discuss something anymore. I've seen conservatives get extremely frustrated that liberals won't entertain their religious myths or traditions as justification for any given policy. "They just don't listen!" No, the conservative just revealed that the entire basis for whatever they believe in isn't founded in reality. No amount of arguing is going to sway them so there's no point in discussing it anymore... "Agree to disagree" is about as far as you can go.
  - Clubber 4y ago
    >Liberals seem to be always willing to entertain the discussion of basically anything. It's sort of a core tenet of liberalism... Open discussion and debate. I'm not sure that is true anymore. Liberals have extremist wings (like Antifa) just like conservatives do. People making liberal arguments now spew the same venom that only conservative groups did 10 years ago. At least in my experience. I think part of the problem is the news likes to take extreme examples of anything and present it as the norm. I have discussions over policy with people all the time and they are quite enlightening.
Veen 4y ago
In my experience, it tends to be used more often by left-wing critics accusing conservatives of engaging in a culture war. The conservative advances a position, and the left-wing person responds that the position is chosen not on its merits but to further the aims of a culture war. It's a way of not having to respond to the substance of a position. Then again, I suppose I have an availability bias. I only see the term used by people I'm paying attention to.

by xg15 4y ago

colordrops 4y ago

That's your own characterization, and not universal. I've personally seen the term more often in non-conservative forums and circles. Not that it matters to your point, which I get and agree with.

r2_pilot 4y ago
Regarding this phenomenon, it may be that you don't see that term in conservative forums because they don't want to use it, whether because it telegraphs their intent or they don't want to use the same words as liberals (this increasingly drastic polarization of language is a key point of Lingua Tertii Imperii... A book I started reading before 2015 and had to quit reading because frankly it bothered me how much it started to resemble current times in the US). So its absence isn't altogether surprising.
dgb23 4y ago
They probably meant historically. If I remember correctly it was coined as a part of a wider strategy decades ago. Of course, it is a catchy term and is being used widely now. Similarly the term political correctness was initially a term used in jest by the left I think.

DocTomoe 4y ago

The term originated in the German "Kulturkampf", which was between the Imperial German state of the 1870s and the Catholic Church. In the US, it was introduced twice, neither time by conservatives.

MockObject 4y ago

The culture war is so profound, we can't even agree on whether it's a culture war or not.

lazide 4y ago

Personally I use it because it’s descriptive. Hard lines being drawn, people unwilling to even talk with others based on ideological labels, economic sanctions against ‘offenders’, propaganda clearly targeted at specific identifiable groups used to raise funds and attack the ‘other’ side, fear and loathing/us vs them. I have an aunt who for economic reasons moved to what she called ‘Trump country’, and she legitimately feared for her life. She got death threats on Facebook when she tried to argue with some of her neighbors on ideological lines. She fell and hurt herself really badly, and everyone pitched in and has been helping her recover though. I haven’t seen it used much anywhere else with any regularity, but I have no interest in following any propaganda outlets anywhere and gave up regularly reading any news 6 months or so ago.

riskable 4y ago
> Hard lines being drawn, people unwilling to even talk with others based on ideological labels, economic sanctions against ‘offenders’, propaganda clearly targeted at specific identifiable groups used to raise funds and attack the ‘other’ side, fear and loathing/us vs them. You're describing today's conservatives. Liberals seem to be always willing to entertain the discussion of basically anything. It's sort of a core tenet of liberalism... Open discussion and debate. Where liberals shut discussions down is when they ask for evidence or at least sound reasoning and aren't presented with anything. That's the logical point where you can't really discuss something anymore. I've seen conservatives get extremely frustrated that liberals won't entertain their religious myths or traditions as justification for any given policy. "They just don't listen!" No, the conservative just revealed that the entire basis for whatever they believe in isn't founded in reality. No amount of arguing is going to sway them so there's no point in discussing it anymore... "Agree to disagree" is about as far as you can go.
- Clubber 4y ago
  >Liberals seem to be always willing to entertain the discussion of basically anything. It's sort of a core tenet of liberalism... Open discussion and debate. I'm not sure that is true anymore. Liberals have extremist wings (like Antifa) just like conservatives do. People making liberal arguments now spew the same venom that only conservative groups did 10 years ago. At least in my experience. I think part of the problem is the news likes to take extreme examples of anything and present it as the norm. I have discussions over policy with people all the time and they are quite enlightening.

Veen 4y ago

In my experience, it tends to be used more often by left-wing critics accusing conservatives of engaging in a culture war. The conservative advances a position, and the left-wing person responds that the position is chosen not on its merits but to further the aims of a culture war. It's a way of not having to respond to the substance of a position. Then again, I suppose I have an availability bias. I only see the term used by people I'm paying attention to.