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Hmm, i guess the point is to inspire HN'ers to think about systematically improving public education (or at least volunteer as a tutor).

by gtani 15y ago

JoshTriplett 15y ago
Personally, I found that community college did a far better job at teaching the material; I suspect that in large part this occurred because the classes fit into a degree program with prerequisites. People would start at the community college, find out that the first-year college classes they needed had prerequisites of material they didn't understand, and go back to the right starting point. We could do worse than to just send all high-school students to a community college, or programs structured like them.
- jseliger 15y ago
  Personally, I found that community college did a far better job at teaching the material; I suspect that in large part this occurred because the classes fit into a degree program with prerequisites. Compared to universities, you're probably right. Most big universities reward faculty and grad students based on research, not on teaching. So faculty and grad students optimize what they're rewarded for, on average. (I made this point in an essay I wrote for students called "How Universities Work:" http://jseliger.com/2010/09/26/how-universities-work-or-what-i-wish-i%e2%80%99d-known-freshman-year-a-guide-to-american-university-life-for-the-uninitiated/ http://jseliger.com/2010/09/26/how-universities-work-or-what... ). If you want to get better teachers or instructors, the universities have to start rewarding staff for that. If they don't, they get what we have now: universities optimized mostly for research with an incidental sideline in teaching. It doesn't help, too, that a lot of students aren't in universities for learning—they're in to party or hang out or burn time or whatever. But that's another subject: http://jseliger.com/2011/10/07/student-choice-employment-skills-and-grade-inflation/ http://jseliger.com/2011/10/07/student-choice-employment-ski... .
  - surfsurge 15y ago
    I would generally agree that historically universities have not been as focused on teaching as research, but I believe there might be a shift in this. Many top-tier engineering schools, such as Purdue, have engineering education departments (https://engineering.purdue.edu/ENE/AboutUs/ https://engineering.purdue.edu/ENE/AboutUs/) looking into the pedagogy of technical education.

Hmm, i guess the point is to inspire HN'ers to think about systematically improving public education (or at least volunteer as a tutor).

by gtani 15y ago

Hmm, i guess the point is to inspire HN'ers to think about systematically improving public education (or at least volunteer as a tutor).

JoshTriplett 15y ago

Personally, I found that community college did a far better job at teaching the material; I suspect that in large part this occurred because the classes fit into a degree program with prerequisites. People would start at the community college, find out that the first-year college classes they needed had prerequisites of material they didn't understand, and go back to the right starting point. We could do worse than to just send all high-school students to a community college, or programs structured like them.

jseliger 15y ago
Personally, I found that community college did a far better job at teaching the material; I suspect that in large part this occurred because the classes fit into a degree program with prerequisites. Compared to universities, you're probably right. Most big universities reward faculty and grad students based on research, not on teaching. So faculty and grad students optimize what they're rewarded for, on average. (I made this point in an essay I wrote for students called "How Universities Work:" http://jseliger.com/2010/09/26/how-universities-work-or-what-i-wish-i%e2%80%99d-known-freshman-year-a-guide-to-american-university-life-for-the-uninitiated/ http://jseliger.com/2010/09/26/how-universities-work-or-what... ). If you want to get better teachers or instructors, the universities have to start rewarding staff for that. If they don't, they get what we have now: universities optimized mostly for research with an incidental sideline in teaching. It doesn't help, too, that a lot of students aren't in universities for learning—they're in to party or hang out or burn time or whatever. But that's another subject: http://jseliger.com/2011/10/07/student-choice-employment-skills-and-grade-inflation/ http://jseliger.com/2011/10/07/student-choice-employment-ski... .
- surfsurge 15y ago
  I would generally agree that historically universities have not been as focused on teaching as research, but I believe there might be a shift in this. Many top-tier engineering schools, such as Purdue, have engineering education departments (https://engineering.purdue.edu/ENE/AboutUs/ https://engineering.purdue.edu/ENE/AboutUs/) looking into the pedagogy of technical education.