21 ms·

> SBF: Well, okay. So you've got this boxes and it’s kind of dumb, but like what's the end game, right? This box is worth zero obviously. It blows my mind that

> SBF: Well, okay. So you've got this boxes and it’s kind of dumb, but like what's the end game, right? This box is worth zero obviously. It blows my mind that the people profiting from this are publicly describing the scheme like this, and nobody seems to care.

ackbar03 4y ago
They are describing this from the perspective of an exchange however. Also most of the initial guys came from Jane Street which is a market maker. While I haven't personally worked at a market maker before, I suspect these guys are less fascinated by crytpocurrencies themselves but by how there is suddenly a whole new class of assets that is ballooning and ripe for market makers. As market makers, they are also understandably less concerned about what an underlying asset itself really is worth, or what it even is, but more about facilitating transactions and arbitraging away inefficiencies. (for example, in the podcast he repeats a few times, "who are we to question what it's worth if the markets have spoken"). So from that perspective I can sort of understand why he described it that way.
Melting_Harps 4y ago
> It blows my mind that the people profiting from this are publicly describing the scheme like this, and nobody seems to care. This is the same guy the media and lots of HN were parroting his 'Bitcoin has no future' artile recently, when it should have been caveated as 'No future as a pump and dump' token for DeFi scams. Which is true, their is really no way to do that in the BTC ecosystem, and for good reason. Wrapping and all that was the closest thing, and to be honest it was short-lived. Sam is a clear example of what happened from 2014 onward, billionaires made from the least interesting aspects of this ecosystem, which incidentally is also why most of VC has poured into this space. Honestly, their is no value in ~95% of alts, they are the 'pink sheets' of the crypto currency space.
onlyrealcuzzo 4y ago
Nobody cares if the make money. Everyone is still filled with hope. They'll care if/when they lose.
CTDOCodebases 4y ago
How much is a share of Amazon worth considering they don't pay any dividends? Isn't this the same thing?
- throwaway_1928 4y ago
  No because Amazon generates earnings but reinvests those in its business to make each share worth more.
  - CTDOCodebases 4y ago
    How does it make the shares worth more if they are not entitled to dividends?
    - adam_arthur 4y ago
      Owning a share of Amazon gives you rights to future dividends, which in theory can be high if they continue to grow EPS. If I promise to pay you $100 10 years from now, is that agreement worthless because you didn't get it today? No you discount the time factor into current value. The people who got wiped out on growth tech don't understand this concept
      - CTDOCodebases 4y ago
        I understand it. It's just that there is a lot of uncertainty. Ultimately I think that different people value things differently. To some people something is worth what someone is willing to pay them for it at the current moment. To others it's worth whatever it is in the story they have concocted in their head.
        adam_arthur 4y ago
        If your sense of worth is derived by anything other than fundamentals, you're setting yourself up for failure. And to lose a lot of money
    - 4y ago

ackbar03 4y ago

They are describing this from the perspective of an exchange however. Also most of the initial guys came from Jane Street which is a market maker. While I haven't personally worked at a market maker before, I suspect these guys are less fascinated by crytpocurrencies themselves but by how there is suddenly a whole new class of assets that is ballooning and ripe for market makers. As market makers, they are also understandably less concerned about what an underlying asset itself really is worth, or what it even is, but more about facilitating transactions and arbitraging away inefficiencies. (for example, in the podcast he repeats a few times, "who are we to question what it's worth if the markets have spoken"). So from that perspective I can sort of understand why he described it that way.

Melting_Harps 4y ago

> It blows my mind that the people profiting from this are publicly describing the scheme like this, and nobody seems to care. This is the same guy the media and lots of HN were parroting his 'Bitcoin has no future' artile recently, when it should have been caveated as 'No future as a pump and dump' token for DeFi scams. Which is true, their is really no way to do that in the BTC ecosystem, and for good reason. Wrapping and all that was the closest thing, and to be honest it was short-lived. Sam is a clear example of what happened from 2014 onward, billionaires made from the least interesting aspects of this ecosystem, which incidentally is also why most of VC has poured into this space. Honestly, their is no value in ~95% of alts, they are the 'pink sheets' of the crypto currency space.

onlyrealcuzzo 4y ago

Nobody cares if the make money. Everyone is still filled with hope. They'll care if/when they lose.

CTDOCodebases 4y ago

How much is a share of Amazon worth considering they don't pay any dividends? Isn't this the same thing?

throwaway_1928 4y ago
No because Amazon generates earnings but reinvests those in its business to make each share worth more.
- CTDOCodebases 4y ago
  How does it make the shares worth more if they are not entitled to dividends?
  - adam_arthur 4y ago
    Owning a share of Amazon gives you rights to future dividends, which in theory can be high if they continue to grow EPS. If I promise to pay you $100 10 years from now, is that agreement worthless because you didn't get it today? No you discount the time factor into current value. The people who got wiped out on growth tech don't understand this concept
    - CTDOCodebases 4y ago
      I understand it. It's just that there is a lot of uncertainty. Ultimately I think that different people value things differently. To some people something is worth what someone is willing to pay them for it at the current moment. To others it's worth whatever it is in the story they have concocted in their head.
      - adam_arthur 4y ago
        If your sense of worth is derived by anything other than fundamentals, you're setting yourself up for failure. And to lose a lot of money
  - 4y ago