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> Uh...Germany's actually recarbonized by shutting down their nuclear [increasing coal and imported electricity to pick up the slack]. Wikipedia contradicts yo

> Uh...Germany's actually recarbonized by shutting down their nuclear [increasing coal and imported electricity to pick up the slack]. Wikipedia contradicts your claim. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electricity_sector_in_Germany https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electricity_sector_in_Germany From wikipeda's article, Germany has been constantly shutting down it's carbon-based energy sources for the past half decade, with dropping to a fraction of its contribution in the past six or seven years alone. Germany currently relies primarily on wind, and wind+solar contribute more than all types of coal.

shakow 4y ago
I don't know what Wiki says, but this here[0] says that right now, Germany is both producing one of the dirtiest electricity in Europe, all while still importing over 1GW. [0] https://app.electricitymap.org/map https://app.electricitymap.org/map
- lispm 4y ago
  Germany has been a large net exporter of electricity for years. 18.9 TWh in 2020. Of that 52.5 TWh were exports and 33.6 TWh were imports. What you may have missed is: Germany is in the middle of Europe surrounded with a bunch of neighbor countries. Most of them are in the European Union which worked for years on building a joint energy market. Thus various electricity exports and imports are NORMAL. Note also that electricity may travel through more than one country in Europe. Germany imports huge amounts of energy from other countries, given that it doesn't have much own resources of Gas, Oil, Uranium - it has some coal, though. Coal, too is imported. Exchanging electricity with other countries will increase massively. In my region there is now a 1 GW power line to Norway to exchange electricity both ways. Another example: Germany, Denmark, Netherlands and Belgium are investing 135 Billion Euros in a joint offshore wind project. https://www.euractiv.com/section/energy/news/germany-denmark-netherlands-and-belgium-sign-e135-billion-offshore-wind-pact/ https://www.euractiv.com/section/energy/news/germany-denmark...
  - shakow 4y ago
    > Germany has been a large net exporter of electricity for years. 18.9 TWh It does not mean anything if they can't decide when they export it. Waht matters though, is that most of the time their electricity has an awful carbon footprint w.r.t what the wealthiest country in Europe should afford. All the rest is but mental gymnastics to try to justify that.
    - lispm 4y ago
      > It does not mean anything if they can't decide when they export it. That makes no sense. The market (demand & supply) decides. The static model is long past. > Waht matters though, is that most of the time their electricity has an awful carbon footprint w.r.t what the wealthiest country in Europe should afford. Germany isn't the wealthiest country in Europe. That it has more inhabitants than, for example Norway, does not make the average German richer. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wealth_distribution_in_Europe https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wealth_distribution_in_Europe What really matters is that the we move fast to renewable energy.
      - shakow 4y ago
        > That makes no sense. The market (demand & supply) decides. The static model is long past. Indeed, the supply. And what is the very charateristic of Germany's renewable supply? That they do not have any inluence of it. They have to sell when the weather is sunny and windy, and have to buy or burn coal otherwise. > does not make the average German richer. That does not really matter, as the average German does not pay for a nuke plant; the federal goverment does. > What really matters is that the we move fast to renewable energy. What really matters is that we move fast to low-carbon energy; renewable is the cherry on the cake.
        lispm 4y ago
        > And what is the very charateristic of Germany's renewable supply? That they do not have any inluence of it. There are more renewable energy sources than wind and sun. Buying electricity is also a good option. Retrieving stored electricity is another. > That does not really matter, as the average German does not pay for a nuke plant; the federal goverment does. The federal government does not pay for nuclear power plants. > What really matters is that we move fast to low-carbon energy; renewable is the cherry on the cake. Renewable is the only viable option.

shakow 4y ago

I don't know what Wiki says, but this here[0] says that right now, Germany is both producing one of the dirtiest electricity in Europe, all while still importing over 1GW. [0] https://app.electricitymap.org/map https://app.electricitymap.org/map

lispm 4y ago
Germany has been a large net exporter of electricity for years. 18.9 TWh in 2020. Of that 52.5 TWh were exports and 33.6 TWh were imports. What you may have missed is: Germany is in the middle of Europe surrounded with a bunch of neighbor countries. Most of them are in the European Union which worked for years on building a joint energy market. Thus various electricity exports and imports are NORMAL. Note also that electricity may travel through more than one country in Europe. Germany imports huge amounts of energy from other countries, given that it doesn't have much own resources of Gas, Oil, Uranium - it has some coal, though. Coal, too is imported. Exchanging electricity with other countries will increase massively. In my region there is now a 1 GW power line to Norway to exchange electricity both ways. Another example: Germany, Denmark, Netherlands and Belgium are investing 135 Billion Euros in a joint offshore wind project. https://www.euractiv.com/section/energy/news/germany-denmark-netherlands-and-belgium-sign-e135-billion-offshore-wind-pact/ https://www.euractiv.com/section/energy/news/germany-denmark...
- shakow 4y ago
  > Germany has been a large net exporter of electricity for years. 18.9 TWh It does not mean anything if they can't decide when they export it. Waht matters though, is that most of the time their electricity has an awful carbon footprint w.r.t what the wealthiest country in Europe should afford. All the rest is but mental gymnastics to try to justify that.
  - lispm 4y ago
    > It does not mean anything if they can't decide when they export it. That makes no sense. The market (demand & supply) decides. The static model is long past. > Waht matters though, is that most of the time their electricity has an awful carbon footprint w.r.t what the wealthiest country in Europe should afford. Germany isn't the wealthiest country in Europe. That it has more inhabitants than, for example Norway, does not make the average German richer. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wealth_distribution_in_Europe https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wealth_distribution_in_Europe What really matters is that the we move fast to renewable energy.
    - shakow 4y ago
      > That makes no sense. The market (demand & supply) decides. The static model is long past. Indeed, the supply. And what is the very charateristic of Germany's renewable supply? That they do not have any inluence of it. They have to sell when the weather is sunny and windy, and have to buy or burn coal otherwise. > does not make the average German richer. That does not really matter, as the average German does not pay for a nuke plant; the federal goverment does. > What really matters is that the we move fast to renewable energy. What really matters is that we move fast to low-carbon energy; renewable is the cherry on the cake.
      - lispm 4y ago
        > And what is the very charateristic of Germany's renewable supply? That they do not have any inluence of it. There are more renewable energy sources than wind and sun. Buying electricity is also a good option. Retrieving stored electricity is another. > That does not really matter, as the average German does not pay for a nuke plant; the federal goverment does. The federal government does not pay for nuclear power plants. > What really matters is that we move fast to low-carbon energy; renewable is the cherry on the cake. Renewable is the only viable option.