4 ms·

Depends on the gambling. Casual games with friends/family is one thing, but definitely teach them that Casinos are not the same thing and exist to part fools (

Depends on the gambling. Casual games with friends/family is one thing, but definitely teach them that Casinos are not the same thing and exist to part fools (or rich people already set for life) from their money, no matter how badass some movies make them out to be. I'd rather they learn risk taking through strategy games with incomplete information (like XCOM 2, Starcraft, Among Us, etc). That gives them a range of strategies to experiment with and will teach the perils of both risking too much and being too conservative. Most traditional gambling assumes a position of "luck is part of the fun" as opposed to treating it as a risk to be managed. Because if you treated it as a risk to be managed, and the requisite luck level is set so high, why play the game in the first place?

User23 4y ago
> Casinos are not the same thing and exist to part fools (or rich people already set for life) from their money, no matter how badass some movies make them out to be. Viewing a casino as a place to make money is certainly an error. However with smart play and a bankroll of $20,000 or more you can get a VIP experience at an excellent average price in Las Vegas. A room, food, and beverage comp from your host can easily have a nominal daily value in the low four digits if you have a nice room and eat and drink at the nice places owned by the property you play at. You will be expected to spend a minimum of four hours a day at the tables though, so it’s not really worth it unless you enjoy the games. Personally I find blackjack and craps entertaining, albeit for very different reasons. Incidentally those games are very close to even odds. You don’t have to beat the house edge, you just have to beat the house edge less their marketing budget. The casino allocates marketing dollars, that is comps, based on your theoretical loss. Last I knew for blackjack the theo assumed a 2% house edge and marketing will refund about 30% of that in comps. That’s regardless of how well or poorly you do. Since even competent basic strategy brings the house edge down to a 0.5% you’re already ahead there.
- jedberg 4y ago
  > However with smart play and a bankroll of $20,000 or more you can get a VIP experience at an excellent average price in Las Vegas. Curious if you could expand on “smart play”? Which strategies do you consider? Just basic BJ strategy and come bets with odds? Or something else? How much do you bet per hand to get RFB comps?
  - User23 4y ago
    Happy to. The key to smart play is proper betting and good social skills. In a nutshell, bet more the more you win and less the more you lose. The simplest approach is to bet 1-2% of your current bankroll[2], rounded such that you don’t annoy your dealer or pit boss (see below). For BJ I usually just do an ace-five count[1] because it’s simple enough I can do it without being distracted from the experience and it moves the needle a few points. But basic strategy is good enough. As for craps yeah, pass and then come every throw with max odds. Don’t pass and don’t come is mathematically superior, but it ruins the experience because everyone including the crew will hate you. Also place six and eight. With respect to RFB, for blackjack they’ll want to see around 4 black chips a hand base bet. But if you have a relationship with a host and can be charming to the pit boss you might get RFB as low as 200 a hand. That’s assuming 4-5 hours a day. You can bring your theo up by just spending a ton of time at the tables but I like to do other things. However I haven’t been to Vegas since just before Covid so I don’t know if or how things have changed. Realize that the pit boss has considerable authority over the comps you do or don’t get. He or she inputs your average bet into the system and if you’re pleasant, toke (tip) the dealers generously, and otherwise show respect they may well rate your play considerably higher than is objectively warranted. Doing this I’ve come out considerably ahead including comps over the course of many years, but I won’t lie I had a bad trip where I lost 15 grand so don’t play with money you can’t afford to lose. Of course I’ve also had several trips where I walked out with five grand or more to my favor. Another social skills aspect is maintaining a good relationship with your host. They can bend the rules for comps too. I just ask them what they need to see for the front end comps they’re offering and exceeding that is how I’ve gotten RFBed. [1] https://wizardofodds.com/games/blackjack/ace-five-count/ https://wizardofodds.com/games/blackjack/ace-five-count/ [2] A good-enough simplification of Kelly’s criterion for my purposes.

User23 4y ago

> Casinos are not the same thing and exist to part fools (or rich people already set for life) from their money, no matter how badass some movies make them out to be. Viewing a casino as a place to make money is certainly an error. However with smart play and a bankroll of $20,000 or more you can get a VIP experience at an excellent average price in Las Vegas. A room, food, and beverage comp from your host can easily have a nominal daily value in the low four digits if you have a nice room and eat and drink at the nice places owned by the property you play at. You will be expected to spend a minimum of four hours a day at the tables though, so it’s not really worth it unless you enjoy the games. Personally I find blackjack and craps entertaining, albeit for very different reasons. Incidentally those games are very close to even odds. You don’t have to beat the house edge, you just have to beat the house edge less their marketing budget. The casino allocates marketing dollars, that is comps, based on your theoretical loss. Last I knew for blackjack the theo assumed a 2% house edge and marketing will refund about 30% of that in comps. That’s regardless of how well or poorly you do. Since even competent basic strategy brings the house edge down to a 0.5% you’re already ahead there.

jedberg 4y ago
> However with smart play and a bankroll of $20,000 or more you can get a VIP experience at an excellent average price in Las Vegas. Curious if you could expand on “smart play”? Which strategies do you consider? Just basic BJ strategy and come bets with odds? Or something else? How much do you bet per hand to get RFB comps?
- User23 4y ago
  Happy to. The key to smart play is proper betting and good social skills. In a nutshell, bet more the more you win and less the more you lose. The simplest approach is to bet 1-2% of your current bankroll[2], rounded such that you don’t annoy your dealer or pit boss (see below). For BJ I usually just do an ace-five count[1] because it’s simple enough I can do it without being distracted from the experience and it moves the needle a few points. But basic strategy is good enough. As for craps yeah, pass and then come every throw with max odds. Don’t pass and don’t come is mathematically superior, but it ruins the experience because everyone including the crew will hate you. Also place six and eight. With respect to RFB, for blackjack they’ll want to see around 4 black chips a hand base bet. But if you have a relationship with a host and can be charming to the pit boss you might get RFB as low as 200 a hand. That’s assuming 4-5 hours a day. You can bring your theo up by just spending a ton of time at the tables but I like to do other things. However I haven’t been to Vegas since just before Covid so I don’t know if or how things have changed. Realize that the pit boss has considerable authority over the comps you do or don’t get. He or she inputs your average bet into the system and if you’re pleasant, toke (tip) the dealers generously, and otherwise show respect they may well rate your play considerably higher than is objectively warranted. Doing this I’ve come out considerably ahead including comps over the course of many years, but I won’t lie I had a bad trip where I lost 15 grand so don’t play with money you can’t afford to lose. Of course I’ve also had several trips where I walked out with five grand or more to my favor. Another social skills aspect is maintaining a good relationship with your host. They can bend the rules for comps too. I just ask them what they need to see for the front end comps they’re offering and exceeding that is how I’ve gotten RFBed. [1] https://wizardofodds.com/games/blackjack/ace-five-count/ https://wizardofodds.com/games/blackjack/ace-five-count/ [2] A good-enough simplification of Kelly’s criterion for my purposes.