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The problem is that Apple intentionally insists that this is the only way to do a repair to scare people away from it - and the media seems to be lapping it up

The problem is that Apple intentionally insists that this is the only way to do a repair to scare people away from it - and the media seems to be lapping it up pretty well and spreading it - I wish the article called out their BS right away. If I had a full-time repair operation going, I'd probably get those tools too. But for a single repair, I can open one with a hair dryer and 20 bucks of iFixit tools faster than it takes to unpack all that kit.

PragmaticPulp 4y ago
> The problem is that Apple intentionally insists that this is the only way to do a repair to scare people away from it As they should. If Apple had instead shipped batteries with instructions for pure DIY repair, we’d be reading an article about “I tried to replace my iPhone battery but I destroyed my iPhone in the process” And if Apple redesigned the iPhone to be bigger so it could have a separate battery compartment with screw and a big old gasket so users could swap batteries, we’d be reading an article titled “Apple ruins new iPhone design for a feature you don’t need” Apple did a great thing with this program. That fact that journalists and HN commenters are getting worked up into a frenzy to complain about it is disappointing. It’s also telling they many people here haven’t worked on car repairs in detail. It’s standard practice for manufacturers to cite specific manufacturer tools as required in the repair manual and want you to pay hundreds or thousands to buy them. And it’s standard practice for DIYers to improvise around it (at their own risk) or purchase cheaper aftermarket custom tools. It would be great news if they offered subsidized tool rental programs like Apple for the repairs. This whole article and the rage around it is beyond silly.
- Nextgrid 4y ago
  > If Apple had instead shipped batteries with instructions for pure DIY repair, we’d be reading an article about “I tried to replace my iPhone battery but I destroyed my iPhone in the process” Is that happening with cars? Because you can trivially walk up to any dealership and buy brake parts. > It’s standard practice for manufacturers to cite specific manufacturer tools Normal, cross-manufacturer tools (aka wrenches, sockets, etc) will get you 90% of the way there, and kludgy, one-off hacks with what you have on hand will usually get you the last 10%. The main problem with regards to Apple and the right to repair is parts availability and intentional restrictions against repair such as part serialization where it still needs Apple to be in the loop to "pair" the part to the new device. Nobody was complaining about the lack of a specific machine to open their iPhone - that problem has been solved already long ago.
  - NovemberWhiskey 4y ago
    >Is that happening with cars? Because you can trivially walk up to any dealership and buy brake parts. What is your point here? You can just buy the parts trivially from Apple too.
    - Nextgrid 4y ago
      Not trivially - see my other comment: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31458161 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31458161
      - sokoloff 4y ago
        Your complaint seems to center around the idea that you don’t want to eat a ~$25 core charge to have standing by on the shelf a replacement battery, which is a part that degrades over a period around 20x slower than ground shipping. As a consumer, why not just order the battery when your battery is down to 80-85% health and it’s about to be convenient to spend a half-hour of quality time with your phone? As repair shop, Apple has already undercut your price to use official supply chain parts, so you’re likely already using the <6RANDOMCAPITALS> branded batteries and the $100 bootleg part programmer.
        Nextgrid 4y ago
        > As a consumer, why not just order the battery when your battery is down to 80-85% health and it’s about to be convenient to spend a half-hour of quality time with your phone? As repair shop, Apple has already undercut your price to use official supply chain parts, so you’re likely already using the <6CAPITALS> branded batteries and the $100 bootleg part programmer. In my case self-repair is more about convenience than money. Bootleg parts/tools are still a better experience for me than shipping a phone to Apple for repair or making appointments to the Apple Store and then reinstalling the software on the new phone (twice, if you have to do it on a spare device to use in the interim). Regarding batteries specifically, I agree, Apple's prices are unbeatable. In my case, my main use-case for self-repair is screens - the batteries are just a bonus because if I'm already in the phone I may as well put a new battery in there. The pricing on screens (including the "core charge") is much higher and makes self-repair more attractive.
- pas 4y ago
  > If Apple had instead shipped batteries with instructions for pure DIY repair, we’d be reading ... Hypothetical. Also they could simply provide the option. They already don't take any responsibility anyway. If someone wants to get it done with a high chance of success they already take it to an Apple store, or ship it to Apple. > This whole article and the rage around it is beyond silly. Yes and no. The article is mostly just tongue in cheek, trying to capitalize on the cheap shock value of the 79 pounds of tools... but the point it implicitly makes is that "right to repair" is not about tools, it's about repairability, design, serviceability, etc. (Which I think is a bit dumb, because most people don't want this, they want cheap phones every few years. What would be much much much better is to price in the externalities of that. Which would give a fighting chance to a vendor that competes on low externality by serviceability.)

PragmaticPulp 4y ago

> The problem is that Apple intentionally insists that this is the only way to do a repair to scare people away from it As they should. If Apple had instead shipped batteries with instructions for pure DIY repair, we’d be reading an article about “I tried to replace my iPhone battery but I destroyed my iPhone in the process” And if Apple redesigned the iPhone to be bigger so it could have a separate battery compartment with screw and a big old gasket so users could swap batteries, we’d be reading an article titled “Apple ruins new iPhone design for a feature you don’t need” Apple did a great thing with this program. That fact that journalists and HN commenters are getting worked up into a frenzy to complain about it is disappointing. It’s also telling they many people here haven’t worked on car repairs in detail. It’s standard practice for manufacturers to cite specific manufacturer tools as required in the repair manual and want you to pay hundreds or thousands to buy them. And it’s standard practice for DIYers to improvise around it (at their own risk) or purchase cheaper aftermarket custom tools. It would be great news if they offered subsidized tool rental programs like Apple for the repairs. This whole article and the rage around it is beyond silly.

Nextgrid 4y ago
> If Apple had instead shipped batteries with instructions for pure DIY repair, we’d be reading an article about “I tried to replace my iPhone battery but I destroyed my iPhone in the process” Is that happening with cars? Because you can trivially walk up to any dealership and buy brake parts. > It’s standard practice for manufacturers to cite specific manufacturer tools Normal, cross-manufacturer tools (aka wrenches, sockets, etc) will get you 90% of the way there, and kludgy, one-off hacks with what you have on hand will usually get you the last 10%. The main problem with regards to Apple and the right to repair is parts availability and intentional restrictions against repair such as part serialization where it still needs Apple to be in the loop to "pair" the part to the new device. Nobody was complaining about the lack of a specific machine to open their iPhone - that problem has been solved already long ago.
- NovemberWhiskey 4y ago
  >Is that happening with cars? Because you can trivially walk up to any dealership and buy brake parts. What is your point here? You can just buy the parts trivially from Apple too.
  - Nextgrid 4y ago
    Not trivially - see my other comment: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31458161 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31458161
    - sokoloff 4y ago
      Your complaint seems to center around the idea that you don’t want to eat a ~$25 core charge to have standing by on the shelf a replacement battery, which is a part that degrades over a period around 20x slower than ground shipping. As a consumer, why not just order the battery when your battery is down to 80-85% health and it’s about to be convenient to spend a half-hour of quality time with your phone? As repair shop, Apple has already undercut your price to use official supply chain parts, so you’re likely already using the <6RANDOMCAPITALS> branded batteries and the $100 bootleg part programmer.
      - Nextgrid 4y ago
        > As a consumer, why not just order the battery when your battery is down to 80-85% health and it’s about to be convenient to spend a half-hour of quality time with your phone? As repair shop, Apple has already undercut your price to use official supply chain parts, so you’re likely already using the <6CAPITALS> branded batteries and the $100 bootleg part programmer. In my case self-repair is more about convenience than money. Bootleg parts/tools are still a better experience for me than shipping a phone to Apple for repair or making appointments to the Apple Store and then reinstalling the software on the new phone (twice, if you have to do it on a spare device to use in the interim). Regarding batteries specifically, I agree, Apple's prices are unbeatable. In my case, my main use-case for self-repair is screens - the batteries are just a bonus because if I'm already in the phone I may as well put a new battery in there. The pricing on screens (including the "core charge") is much higher and makes self-repair more attractive.
pas 4y ago
> If Apple had instead shipped batteries with instructions for pure DIY repair, we’d be reading ... Hypothetical. Also they could simply provide the option. They already don't take any responsibility anyway. If someone wants to get it done with a high chance of success they already take it to an Apple store, or ship it to Apple. > This whole article and the rage around it is beyond silly. Yes and no. The article is mostly just tongue in cheek, trying to capitalize on the cheap shock value of the 79 pounds of tools... but the point it implicitly makes is that "right to repair" is not about tools, it's about repairability, design, serviceability, etc. (Which I think is a bit dumb, because most people don't want this, they want cheap phones every few years. What would be much much much better is to price in the externalities of that. Which would give a fighting chance to a vendor that competes on low externality by serviceability.)