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I am only half the author's age but, in my limited experience, the only thing worse than loneliness is the stifling weight of the impositions and compromises th

I am only half the author's age but, in my limited experience, the only thing worse than loneliness is the stifling weight of the impositions and compromises that come with virtually all relationships. The ones that offer enough in return to offset this weight make up the tiniest minority

azemetre 4y ago
Can you explain what you mean by this? It sounds like a contradiction, loneliness is bad but friendship is worse?
- wly_cdgr 4y ago
  In my experience, yes, though with (very rare) exceptions. I don't see it as a contradiction, though
  - onlyrealcuzzo 4y ago
    I think the point of good friendships is that they aren't this way.
- colechristensen 4y ago
  Bad friends can be worse than no friends, and a series of bad luck could make a person believe that the only friends are bad ones (alternatively unrealistic expectations could cause this too)
  - openknot 4y ago
    Bad relationships, including friendships, can cause one to adopt poor communication habits (e.g. guilting others or ghosting others), and also have a higher tolerance for negative behavior instead of communicating a boundary. There is a bit more discussion on this in an old Hacker News thread from February 2020, where several people discuss the serious impact of unhealthy relationships in the quality of one's life: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22214066 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22214066
stuxnet79 4y ago
Your last sentence hints at why so many relationships fail these days. Most people do not look at relationships as something that requires effort and needs to be nurtured. Instead they look at them as transactional affairs, and like any transaction extracting more value than you are willing to give back is the modus operandi.
- colechristensen 4y ago
  I have a few relationships that just don’t need to be nurtured. Months could go by with littlev or no contact with no harm done alternatively sometimes they are every day interactions. It is not easy to find that kind of kinship, but when you do they aren’t things that need to be intentionally fed. (This isn’t of course how you should treat your mother or your spouse)
wfme 4y ago
You are describing transactional relationships, but there are other types of more self perpetuating relationships. Transactional relationships are built on the expectation for reciprocation, so every interaction is performed with the expected outcome in mind. Within a transactional relationship, bonds are broken the moment one of you doesn't hold up your end. For this reason, these relationships tend to be fragile and do not last. In contrast, bonds between two parties can be much stronger in relational relationships. These non-transactional relationships are meant to be long-term and often exists between parents and children, or between long term romantic partners. In a relational relationship, both parties are willing to make sacrifices for the sake of their bond. They are both concerned with the perspective, needs, and desires of the other party. To a certain extent, individuals are willing to give without expecting anything in return. This helps to build strong bonds that are difficult to break. I would suggest trying to seek out and develop more relational relationships as they can be extremely rewarding without taking the toll you describe.
- walleeee 4y ago
  Imposition and compromise need not derive from a transactional relationship model One can just as well feel compelled to constantly compromise if one's acquaintances don't share one's needs and values, for instance
  - sbf501 4y ago
    In my 30's my therapist called that "being a doormat."
    - walleeee 4y ago
      my sense is there are defensible reasons you might not want to be assertive or entirely transparent to everyone around you doesn't necessarily mean you're letting yourself be trampled
      - sbf501 4y ago
        It is not healthy to live under that kind of pressure from others. And one thing therapy taught me: there is absolutely no reason for you to live under that kind of pressure. None. It is your choice.
throwawayboise 4y ago
I'm getting close to 60. I live alone since my wife moved out 20 years ago. The closest friend I have was a co-worker who retired at the end of 2021 and I have not seen him since. I enjoy it. I can do whatever I want, whenever I want. I don't have to consider anyone else when I decide what I'm going to do. If I want to stay at the gym for an extra hour, I do. Nobody will complain about it when I get home. If I don't feel like doing the dishes tonight, I don't. If I want to sleep until noon, I do. Nobody will wake me up. Everything that happens in my life is a result of what I decide to do (or not do).
- beebeepka 4y ago
  This is somewhat surprising coming from an old guy. I find it hilarious that a grown man would need permission from the wife simple things such as time spent at the gym and whatnot. Been together with my wife for almost 25 years. I guess I got lucky because I have very little to complain about. In fact, I am glad she didn't leave me after I spent 15 years chasing fun and parties.

azemetre 4y ago

Can you explain what you mean by this? It sounds like a contradiction, loneliness is bad but friendship is worse?

wly_cdgr 4y ago
In my experience, yes, though with (very rare) exceptions. I don't see it as a contradiction, though
- onlyrealcuzzo 4y ago
  I think the point of good friendships is that they aren't this way.
colechristensen 4y ago
Bad friends can be worse than no friends, and a series of bad luck could make a person believe that the only friends are bad ones (alternatively unrealistic expectations could cause this too)
- openknot 4y ago
  Bad relationships, including friendships, can cause one to adopt poor communication habits (e.g. guilting others or ghosting others), and also have a higher tolerance for negative behavior instead of communicating a boundary. There is a bit more discussion on this in an old Hacker News thread from February 2020, where several people discuss the serious impact of unhealthy relationships in the quality of one's life: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22214066 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22214066

stuxnet79 4y ago

Your last sentence hints at why so many relationships fail these days. Most people do not look at relationships as something that requires effort and needs to be nurtured. Instead they look at them as transactional affairs, and like any transaction extracting more value than you are willing to give back is the modus operandi.

colechristensen 4y ago
I have a few relationships that just don’t need to be nurtured. Months could go by with littlev or no contact with no harm done alternatively sometimes they are every day interactions. It is not easy to find that kind of kinship, but when you do they aren’t things that need to be intentionally fed. (This isn’t of course how you should treat your mother or your spouse)

wfme 4y ago

You are describing transactional relationships, but there are other types of more self perpetuating relationships. Transactional relationships are built on the expectation for reciprocation, so every interaction is performed with the expected outcome in mind. Within a transactional relationship, bonds are broken the moment one of you doesn't hold up your end. For this reason, these relationships tend to be fragile and do not last. In contrast, bonds between two parties can be much stronger in relational relationships. These non-transactional relationships are meant to be long-term and often exists between parents and children, or between long term romantic partners. In a relational relationship, both parties are willing to make sacrifices for the sake of their bond. They are both concerned with the perspective, needs, and desires of the other party. To a certain extent, individuals are willing to give without expecting anything in return. This helps to build strong bonds that are difficult to break. I would suggest trying to seek out and develop more relational relationships as they can be extremely rewarding without taking the toll you describe.

walleeee 4y ago
Imposition and compromise need not derive from a transactional relationship model One can just as well feel compelled to constantly compromise if one's acquaintances don't share one's needs and values, for instance
- sbf501 4y ago
  In my 30's my therapist called that "being a doormat."
  - walleeee 4y ago
    my sense is there are defensible reasons you might not want to be assertive or entirely transparent to everyone around you doesn't necessarily mean you're letting yourself be trampled
    - sbf501 4y ago
      It is not healthy to live under that kind of pressure from others. And one thing therapy taught me: there is absolutely no reason for you to live under that kind of pressure. None. It is your choice.

throwawayboise 4y ago

I'm getting close to 60. I live alone since my wife moved out 20 years ago. The closest friend I have was a co-worker who retired at the end of 2021 and I have not seen him since. I enjoy it. I can do whatever I want, whenever I want. I don't have to consider anyone else when I decide what I'm going to do. If I want to stay at the gym for an extra hour, I do. Nobody will complain about it when I get home. If I don't feel like doing the dishes tonight, I don't. If I want to sleep until noon, I do. Nobody will wake me up. Everything that happens in my life is a result of what I decide to do (or not do).

beebeepka 4y ago
This is somewhat surprising coming from an old guy. I find it hilarious that a grown man would need permission from the wife simple things such as time spent at the gym and whatnot. Been together with my wife for almost 25 years. I guess I got lucky because I have very little to complain about. In fact, I am glad she didn't leave me after I spent 15 years chasing fun and parties.