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The Volkswagen Group is using IE6 as standard for displaying web pages
- moomin 15y agoApparently they don't recommend other browsers as they show security gaps. I'm glad the security experts of VW have finally decided to share their knowledge with the world. A pity they don't make routers and anti-virus software, rather than cars.
- natesm 15y agoI see that you'll also need either a PC or a Media Access Control.
- lawnchair_larry 15y agoAh, that's why my Message Authentication Code wasn't working.
- rbanffy 15y agoGood for you. I tried several hours of Murawarri aboriginal chants and was ready to start with the Miappe ones... ;-)
- cubicle67 15y agoThis'd just be a case of yet another page that's never been updated. I think my bank's site recommends either IE or netscape - site works fine, just that no one's ever updated the required browser page
- hetman 15y agoThough claiming IE6 was the most secure web browser in 2009 is still pretty worrying.
- cubicle67 15y agoer, yeah... that one's a bit more difficult to explain :/
- artursapek 15y agoMy thoughts too. A mention of Netscape but not Chrome? Has to be several years old.
- ricree 15y agoThey don't mention ie 7+ either. It's possible they just ignored it, but given the other browsers mentioned it seems likely that this was written when 6 was the most recent Internet Explorer. So we could easily be talking 2006 or before.
- freedompeace 15y agoFor a well-designed website, I must say, I'm a bit worried. > The cooperation takes place by our Group Business Platform using current security standards and ciphering methods. A secure data interchange has high priority! Because that's all there is to security. > All data is transferred with a 128 Bit SSL coding and are even secured by your log in on our Group Business Platform. This ciphering method is used in all areas of the platform and is added with further certificates. I didn't realise we could code in SSL. > The Volkswagen Group is using Microsoft Internet Explorer 6 as standard the for displaying web pages. For the daily work with our platform, we recommend you to use the Microsoft Internet Explorer 6, too. IE6 ftw! > By using the current version and the updates provided by Microsoft we guarantee you a secure connection. I must have been living under a rock; I thought that it was because Internet Explorer was so insecure that I get patches every week for it. Oh, but then again, those were security issues with the rendering, not the connection. It must be the connection that is so important! > For security reasons, the Volkswagen Group does not recommend other browsers like Mozilla Firefox, Opera, Netscape etc. as they show security gaps. Oh. Okay. I understand.
- 5hoom 15y agoYou forgot this bit in the technical requirements: -PC or MAC with internet connection -Web Browser (Microsoft Internet Explorer 6 is recommended) So... they mean a (pretty old) PC with internet connection then?
- kennyma 15y agoI hope this is because they haven't updated the content of the page in a while.
- idspispopd 15y ago<meta name="date" content="2009-10-20" /> Although even in 2009 I still wouldn't recommend IE6.
- rmoriz 15y agorecent access logs with requests from VW still show IE6 :-/
- asadotzler 15y ago"By using the current version and the updates provided by Microsoft we guarantee you a secure connection." Is that a "legal" guarantee? Seems kind of dangerous for a company to make that kind of claim about 3rd party software.
- antimora 15y agoFor some reason the corporate world is still stuck with IE6. Just recently we were dealing with a large corporation that was still using IE6 throughout the company and our web app had to support this browser.
- rmoriz 15y agoThe reason in Germany is mainly SAP (because of its popularity here) Their Netweaver product was build with lots of ActiveX + OS stuff that's so proprietary, that it will not work with even IE7. Of course SAP has released upgrades but companies have to pay for it or change larger parts of their ERP to be able to apply the upgrades. As ERPs are propably upgraded once per decade, this will take some time... From various access logs I've analyzed, I can say that Daimler, Merck (the Germany Merck), Bayer, Deutsche Post and some Governments (Bundeszentralamt für Steuern) still run IE6 in wide-scale deployments. It seems that only view companies provide alternative, modern browsers to their users or the users don't use them and stick with their IE6 default (as they know from SAP Portal) even when browsing externaly.
- cnvogel 15y agoWorking in a ~50000 employee company that shall remain nameless I can give you another datapoint from "big companies" out there: We only got IE8 (on WinXP, Win7 will not launch for another year or two) this year. And before that it was whatever IE version ships with WinXP. The alternative we can use is a Firefox that has not been updated since its rollout in 2009. And of course you are not allowed to use other than company-managed software, especially web-browsers are tightly regulated, exceptions granted only for a few chosen employees. The policy regarding webbrowsers explicitly states that this is done to avoid having people running outdated versions of them...
- nicwest 15y agoWow that's amazing, sometimes I wonder how IT staff get up in the morning and go to sleep at night. Could it be that they are using some sort of monitoring software that actually utilises the flaws in these out of date browsers?
- emilsedgh 15y ago"For security reasons, the Volkswagen Group does not recommend other browsers like Mozilla Firefox, Opera, Netscape etc. as they show security gaps." This probably means they have serious security holes which could be easily triggered by other browsers.
- joelthelion 15y agoI think it simply means that this page was written more than five years ago.
- troymc 15y agoIndeed. Aol stopped supporting Netscape (the browser) in 2008. Ref: http://www.thetechherald.com/article.php/200810/312/Netscape-Navigator-heads-to-the-twilight-of-oblivion http://www.thetechherald.com/article.php/200810/312/Netscape...
- nantes 15y agoNot exactly conclusive, but <meta name="date" content="2009-10-20" /> in the source seems to indicate otherwise.
- chris_dcosta 15y agoFunny - only the other day I posted on this: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3129438 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3129438 It seems that the current post "outs" the security function. I wonder if it was carefully worded by someone who knew better as it appears to be a very good advert for attracting "unwanted" attention.
- coldarchon 15y agoSomebody please explain to me what new browsers have that a car manufacturing corporation needs for its daily business. Flash games? WebGL? Or a bit lower, popup-blocker and google search field? HELLO? Obviously this entry is for unexperienced people of the IT, which neglect the fact that your stuff is only safe as long someone hasn't found it's weakness. http://youtu.be/sforhbLiwLA http://youtu.be/sforhbLiwLA AND - CAN YOU BELIEVE IT, REVERSI!
- deleted 15y ago[deleted]
- MichaelApproved 15y ago"Obviously this entry is for unexperienced people of the IT" They are giving the unexperianced wrong information and making them misinformed. If they want to help the unexperianced, they shouldn't tell them that a secure experience can be guaranteed with IE6. They should encourage them to use modern browsers which are still regularly supported with security patches.
- coldarchon 15y agohoney you DID read it's in their B2B folder? So this is for BUSINESS TO BUSINESS and they want to interact in a secure way with small companies which probably have 0 IT professionals and old software. You only prove me ..
- dextorious 15y ago"honey"? Really? He only proves you wrong. The fact that is for B2B doesn't change a damn thing, false and dangerous information is false and dangerous information, and in fact EVEN MORE SO, since it is addressed to "small companies which probably have 0 IT professionals and old software".
- sp332 15y agoOld software? That can't be right, since the page expects everyone to have the latest version and all updates from MS.
- arunoda 15y agoI think this document is pretty old as they have mentioned Netscape which is no longer exists. And even didn't notices Google Chrome. :-)
- west1737 15y agoI can understand- at my last job (multi-national CPG manufacturer) the code on all the internal webpages wouldn't even display in Firefox. Between the IT workload and general paranoia / superstition of execs (any change is bad), there was no motivation to upgrade internal software. So we made all of our suppliers comply if they wanted access to any piece of the intranet. Just easier that way. For companies that don't rely heavily on internet tech, understanding why you don't want to use IE6 is beyond most people.
- freedompeace 15y agoExcept that they're boasting about how good their software and coding are...
- rnadna 15y agoEven those who don't know whether the word "data" is singular or plural tend to be consistent ... not this crew. "All data is transferred with a 128 Bit SSL coding and are even secured by your log in on our Group Business Platform."
- robinduckett 15y agoAs someone who works for a car dealership which uses these systems I can tell you that the "VWG Desktop" intranet dashboards are only accessible via VPN'd tunnels that you can't just "connect" to from the standard internet. Further more, we use their systems with Chrome, Firefox and other browsers with no problems. Maybe the standard is different with the US, but in the UK this doesn't apply.
- hm2k 15y agoPeugeot suffers with the same issue: http://landing.peugeotlink.co.uk/browser1.php http://landing.peugeotlink.co.uk/browser1.php I think this is pretty common through the motor trade. They simply cannot move quick enough.
- radagaisus 15y agoIt's pretty common for big organizations. In one of our websites it is still recommended to use IE5.5+ As much as I want I can't drop support for IE6, it's still 40% of my crowd (old people ftw).
- FuzzyDunlop 15y agoOne time a few years ago I was contracted to redesign a large Mercedes dealership's website. They recommended IE6 too but the main issue wasn't what the user saw when visiting the page, it was the supplier CMS used to administrate it. This was enforced by Mercedes themselves, so all dealerships had to use it. It was custom, and, this is no exaggeration, impossible to use. There was probably a 600 page manual, caked in dust in some forgotten supply cupboard, detailing what exactly you had to do after you'd managed the Herculean task of logging in. Editing a simple block of text required 'unlocking' it, which would for some reason lock other elements. And then when you did change the text it might not have let you save it anyway, providing plenty of incomprehensible error messages. I must have put a mental block on the rest because I quit after just a day of figuring it out, but my guess is that pages like that still exist because no bugger can figure out how to edit them. I'd be surprised if VW didn't use the same or a similar CMS themselves.
- maushu 15y agoWell, this kind of made me feel better. The CMS I maintain at work is not so bad compared to this.
- nihilocrat 15y agoThis sounds like the most common reaction to users accidentally causing errors in data: lock everything down and only allow a very specific operation, and complain loudly and specifically (i.e., incomprehensibly) if they get out of line, in order to protect the data. Did someone find a new way to screw up? Add another restriction. I sometimes wonder why these interfaces are so freaking common for anything not facing the general public.
- recoiledsnake 15y ago>I sometimes wonder why these interfaces are so freaking common for anything not facing the general public. It's simple, the choice is to either use it or find a new job. Quitting is not easy or practical to many people. Even the general public faces such choices with atrocious bank, DMV, govt sites etc. written 10 years ago in with CGI or ASP. (and a COBOL backend).
- tzury 15y agoBy using the current version and the updates provided by Microsoft we guarantee you a secure connection. Tell this to Microsoft which currently formally stated: "it’s time to say goodbye to IE6" at http://www.ie6countdown.com/ http://www.ie6countdown.com/ 10 years ago a browser was born. Its name was Internet Explorer 6. Now that we’re in 2011, in an era of modern web standards, it’s time to say goodbye. This website is dedicated to watching Internet Explorer 6 usage drop to less than 1% worldwide, so more websites can choose to drop support for Internet Explorer 6, saving hours of work for web developers.
- raphaelcruzeiro 15y agoThis must be some kind of joke right? The trolling of the year?
- tibbon 15y agoA few years ago I remember thinking of applying for a position at VW, yet their blind adherence to IE really turned me off. Its gotta be a indicator of the culture there.
- samd 15y agoDoes anyone else get the feeling that the entire automotive industry could be disrupted by a company that focused on design, usability, and modern technology in their car interiors? It seems to me you could replace just about every car's dashboard with an iPad and already be light-years ahead of the industry standard. In fact the problem seems to get worse as you add more technology and money; if Top Gear is any indication the supercars of the world are all a usability joke. They have a dizzying array of meaningless, misplaced, and practically useless buttons. I believe on the latest Ferrari you can either see your speed or your position on a map, but not both. It seems very similar to the phone industry before the iPhone.
- laut 15y agoThe dashboard is not the most important thing in the entire automotive industry. Car companies are focusing on design. They are spending billions on it. Regarding the Ferrari 458, it can show the current speed as a number while showing the map at the same time.
- samd 15y agoI know it's not the important thing in the entire automotive industry. But I think it just might be to the average driver. Assuming, of course, you've got the mechanics right. Like a hierarchy of needs, having a reliable car to go from point A to B is the foundation. If you had already had a car with the same performance, reliability, safety, efficiency, etc. of a Honda Civic how could you beat Honda?
- botker 15y agoYes, the dashboard / HUD could be a sweet mobile device if only manufacturers thought of it as a computing platform. They could ship with a package manager (or "app store", what have you), and offer an API to the car. If they allow competition amongst app makers then usability standards should naturally increase. Of course it would be necessary for car-makers to set high minimum standards of safety in app design, and to enforce those standards strictly. I've considered starting a car company around this principle, but the barrier to entry is daunting.
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- russell 15y agoApologies for being mind-numbingly obvious, but this is an opportunity for being very disruptive, and similar opportunities exist in every hide-bound industry. Unfortunately you cant do it on a ramen or even a YC budget. However if you work for a feisty player and can convince them that there is money to be made in selling their back office software, you have a chance. A few years ago I almost pulled it off until the principals realized the cost of HN grade sr developers. And most of you wont be in a position to do so, because you avoid these industries like the plague. :-)
- ToastOpt 15y ago"using the current version and the updates provided by Microsoft" If you have a current, up to date version of IE, it's not version 6. We've been trolled by what is clearly some sort of prank.
- BetterThanThou 15y agoFinally a company that does not listen to the idiots who think they know something! IE6 is a great standard. Keep your CSS tips and tricks for your personal website. IE6 is a good default to work around. Anyone who says otherwise 1.) is trying to sell you something (probably web design) or 2.) is ignorant and hipster.
- deleted 15y ago[deleted]
- etanol 15y agoIs it april 1st already?
- dlikhten 15y agoI am running osx, and I really want to be secure. How do I get this IE6 nonesense.
- arenbo 15y agoSome bank's have problems with new browsers, it's strange.
- kaneraz 15y agoI found the link at the bottom to download Adobe as the cherry on top. Let's make sure you have a few other problems along with IE6.