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Yep, users love it. People on HN hate it because we're weirdos and many of us interact with it on the publisher side rather than the user side. It's like asking

Yep, users love it. People on HN hate it because we're weirdos and many of us interact with it on the publisher side rather than the user side. It's like asking cashiers what they think of self checkout.

Semaphor 4y ago
Nah, we hate it because it does weird stuff like slowing down adblocker users. I don’t care about AMP work-wise, we never considered using it. But I hate it as a user, and back when it briefly became a thing, I used extensions to route me to the actual link instead of the google hosted page.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
ocdtrekkie 4y ago
- sanderjd 4y ago
  For what it's worth, in my experience Google employees, being part of the same bubble as HN at large, almost entirely despise AMP. It's a big company and a very tiny number of people work on or adjacent to AMP.
  - ocdtrekkie 4y ago
    I think the point I would emphasize and criticize about your remarks is not that "Googlers love AMP", but that "Googlers believe that users love AMP". One thing I hope that you will learn with time is that Google religiously indoctrinates a trust in data that is extremely, extremely wrong. And that Googlers are taught to shut down arguments based on the inherent trust in that internal data that they obviously can't share publicly or permit external review of. And I say this as someone who has provided extensive in-home computer support to senior citizens. I understand the world far outside the HN bubble because I actively work with people about as far outside of it as you can get.
    - sanderjd 4y ago
      I don't think the second statement is true at all. At least I've never had a discussion with a Google employee who expressed that. My opinions come from watching my friends and family who are not techies (by profession or inclination) navigate the web. It's not that AMP is great or anything, it's that most web pages now really suck. I think people really underestimate the extent to which Google (like all giant companies) is a collection of really separate organizations. I don't know any more about or have any closer attachment to AMP than any other nerd that uses the internet. I just think it is the best of the bad solutions to the out of control slow bloat problem with web pages now (and for quite awhile).
nerdjon 4y ago
Users don't know what AMP is. If it suddenly went away most users would never say a thing. To say that "users love it" implies they know it exists in the first place. The internet was just fine before AMP was a thing.
- sanderjd 4y ago
  If it went away users would vaguely wonder why the search results links they follow are now slow loading and more ad blighted than they were recently. They love the outcome without knowing what is achieving it.
  - Mindwipe 4y ago
    > If it went away users would vaguely wonder why the search results links they follow are now slow loading and more ad blighted than they were recently. They love the outcome without knowing what is achieving it. They'd be pretty happy that the webpages then landed on y'know, worked.
  - nerdjon 4y ago
    I highly doubt any user would make that connection. At best they will think that some sites put out a UI change (which is normal) at worst they will think that their internet is a bit slow for a bit and in a few days won't think about it again. You are assuming that the normal user would assume that different websites behaving slightly differently would somehow be connected. That is assuming way too much technical knowledge on the case of an average consumer. You are also parroting a supposed benefit when not only has cellular gotten faster, home internet, wifi, general internet infrastructure has also gotten faster and the idea that we need AMP for something to load fast is... frankly a lie. As far as ads go... maybe? But in my experience anywhere that AMP would actually be used, I don't see this issue (and I also don't want google having more power over ads). I have an app on my phone to always redirect AMP and I don't experience any issues because of it. Users will not care. Or notice, or think about it for more than a minute of "Oh hey, this site changed something" and move on with their day. Edit: The fact that google had to strong-arm publishes into this (when if it did what it claimed, publishes should love it!). Has continued to refuse to give users the ability to disable it. Shows that users don't care. Google knows that if they gave the option, people would disable it because someone told them they should. But the unfortunate truth is we don't know for 100% certainty how users feel because no choice was given.

Semaphor 4y ago

Nah, we hate it because it does weird stuff like slowing down adblocker users. I don’t care about AMP work-wise, we never considered using it. But I hate it as a user, and back when it briefly became a thing, I used extensions to route me to the actual link instead of the google hosted page.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

ocdtrekkie 4y ago

sanderjd 4y ago
For what it's worth, in my experience Google employees, being part of the same bubble as HN at large, almost entirely despise AMP. It's a big company and a very tiny number of people work on or adjacent to AMP.
- ocdtrekkie 4y ago
  I think the point I would emphasize and criticize about your remarks is not that "Googlers love AMP", but that "Googlers believe that users love AMP". One thing I hope that you will learn with time is that Google religiously indoctrinates a trust in data that is extremely, extremely wrong. And that Googlers are taught to shut down arguments based on the inherent trust in that internal data that they obviously can't share publicly or permit external review of. And I say this as someone who has provided extensive in-home computer support to senior citizens. I understand the world far outside the HN bubble because I actively work with people about as far outside of it as you can get.
  - sanderjd 4y ago
    I don't think the second statement is true at all. At least I've never had a discussion with a Google employee who expressed that. My opinions come from watching my friends and family who are not techies (by profession or inclination) navigate the web. It's not that AMP is great or anything, it's that most web pages now really suck. I think people really underestimate the extent to which Google (like all giant companies) is a collection of really separate organizations. I don't know any more about or have any closer attachment to AMP than any other nerd that uses the internet. I just think it is the best of the bad solutions to the out of control slow bloat problem with web pages now (and for quite awhile).

nerdjon 4y ago

Users don't know what AMP is. If it suddenly went away most users would never say a thing. To say that "users love it" implies they know it exists in the first place. The internet was just fine before AMP was a thing.

sanderjd 4y ago
If it went away users would vaguely wonder why the search results links they follow are now slow loading and more ad blighted than they were recently. They love the outcome without knowing what is achieving it.
- Mindwipe 4y ago
  > If it went away users would vaguely wonder why the search results links they follow are now slow loading and more ad blighted than they were recently. They love the outcome without knowing what is achieving it. They'd be pretty happy that the webpages then landed on y'know, worked.
- nerdjon 4y ago
  I highly doubt any user would make that connection. At best they will think that some sites put out a UI change (which is normal) at worst they will think that their internet is a bit slow for a bit and in a few days won't think about it again. You are assuming that the normal user would assume that different websites behaving slightly differently would somehow be connected. That is assuming way too much technical knowledge on the case of an average consumer. You are also parroting a supposed benefit when not only has cellular gotten faster, home internet, wifi, general internet infrastructure has also gotten faster and the idea that we need AMP for something to load fast is... frankly a lie. As far as ads go... maybe? But in my experience anywhere that AMP would actually be used, I don't see this issue (and I also don't want google having more power over ads). I have an app on my phone to always redirect AMP and I don't experience any issues because of it. Users will not care. Or notice, or think about it for more than a minute of "Oh hey, this site changed something" and move on with their day. Edit: The fact that google had to strong-arm publishes into this (when if it did what it claimed, publishes should love it!). Has continued to refuse to give users the ability to disable it. Shows that users don't care. Google knows that if they gave the option, people would disable it because someone told them they should. But the unfortunate truth is we don't know for 100% certainty how users feel because no choice was given.