5 ms·

More generally I had read on HN a while ago that this is the reason why doctors don't do a Full-body radiography/scan. Because many humans have bugs/anomalies t

More generally I had read on HN a while ago that this is the reason why doctors don't do a Full-body radiography/scan. Because many humans have bugs/anomalies that are mild/non-issues but are ambiguous and anxiety prone. The latter (and most salient reason tragically) is that the doctos by covering much more data, would become legally responsible for not seeing (e.g. a tumor found in a place that wasn't the tissue/region target of the original investigation) I find those really sad and I want to have a whole body radio (and disclose that I take the anxiety cost willfully and that I abandon my right to sue the doctor for this specific radio), is it possible? Is there a place where this can be done?

thaeli 4y ago
In the US, many "concierge" doctors (the ones who don't take insurance) will order this type of scan if you want it.
- SemanticStrengh 4y ago
  I wasn't aware, how does that even work, radio machines can fit a whole body field of view? Thx I'm in EU unfortunately.
  - JumpCrisscross 4y ago
    > how does that even work It’s just a full-body MRI. Costs a couple thousand dollars. Would put it in the category of neat curiosity and possibly useful as a baseline or if you have surprise cancer or something. But totally unnecessary and to be avoided if you’re prone to medical anxiety.
    - SemanticStrengh 4y ago
      > Costs a couple thousand dollars Why such scaling with the size? Pure greed? The guy has mostly to push a button..
      - cryoz 4y ago
        A radiologist would need to interpret the MRI.
        SemanticStrengh 4y ago
        1) well 1000 dollar per hour seems like a non-reasonable price. 2) one should have a legal right to command a MRI scan without paid analysis.
        deleted 4y ago
        [deleted]
        JumpCrisscross 4y ago
        > 1000 dollar per hour seems like a non-reasonable price MRIs are expensive machinery that take highly-trained and well-paid technicians to maintain and operate. The imaging process takes an hour alone; start to finish, it's a two-hour process that is far from just pushing a button. > one should have a legal right to command a MRI scan without paid analysis I don't think there is a law, in America, prohibiting MRIs without expert analysis. But one, that's useless. And two, the people who don't think it's useless are the ones most likely to misinterpret the data and cause problems for the MRI provider.
        AnIdiotOnTheNet 4y ago
        > Google Query: cost of an MRI in India > Result: How much does an MRI scan cost in India? The average cost of MRI scan in India is usually between Rs. 1500 to Rs. 25000. > Query: Rs. 25000 in US dollars > Result: 25,000 Indian Rupee equals 321.02 United States Dollar ...so ok, there's a chance the first answer is wrong and/or there's some factor I'm missing, but assuming it isn't one must again ask the question: Why does an MRI cost $5k? For the record, asking specifically about a full body scan did not change the price: > Query: cost of an full body MRI in India > Result: [...] And the full-body scan cost you between INR 18000 to INR 25000 in India.
AlphaOne1 4y ago
The question that needs to asked though is: what would you do with that information? Would you be willing to undergo biopsy (which is the standard for diagnosis) knowing there is a non-zero risk of complication. What if the biopsy is not conclusive? Do we then do a major surgery which includes risk of death? Imaging is NOT diagnostic for tumors. For most lesions, you have to take tissue samples. Disclosure: I'm a pathologist.
- SemanticStrengh 4y ago
  > what would you do with that information? Well for starters anyone should check he has the right number of each organ, and at the right place (not ectoplasmic), and that their shape and volume is not pathologic. You should also check your bones joints to check wether you have metallic accumulation or not. It's not just about tumors. In any cases, there are generally many possibles diagnosises that do not involve a biopsy, such as blood/urine/lymph/fecal biomarkers, and DNA testing. In some cases you might even consider biofluorescence. Secondly, if a thing look like a tumor, I would study the risk and if very low I would proceed for a biopsy (risk seems OK) or otherwise use anticarcinogenic drugs. I would not proceed to a risky surgery unless necessary though, especially in an era where potent anticarcinogenic exists such as PNC-27 BTW it's very cool that this is a thing> https://www.nlm.nih.gov/research/visible/getting_data.html https://www.nlm.nih.gov/research/visible/getting_data.html
bsder 4y ago
> Full-body radiography/scan. Because many humans have bugs/anomalies that are mild/non-issues but are ambiguous and anxiety prone. These scans aren't magic. Most of the time you need a "contrast agent" to find things. That means an injection (and attendant infection risk) and circulation of a strange substance in your body. In the case of Gadolinium, there's about a 1 in 1000 reaction risk. So, you don't want to go injecting that into people without a good reason.

thaeli 4y ago

In the US, many "concierge" doctors (the ones who don't take insurance) will order this type of scan if you want it.

SemanticStrengh 4y ago
I wasn't aware, how does that even work, radio machines can fit a whole body field of view? Thx I'm in EU unfortunately.
- JumpCrisscross 4y ago
  > how does that even work It’s just a full-body MRI. Costs a couple thousand dollars. Would put it in the category of neat curiosity and possibly useful as a baseline or if you have surprise cancer or something. But totally unnecessary and to be avoided if you’re prone to medical anxiety.
  - SemanticStrengh 4y ago
    > Costs a couple thousand dollars Why such scaling with the size? Pure greed? The guy has mostly to push a button..
    - cryoz 4y ago
      A radiologist would need to interpret the MRI.
      - SemanticStrengh 4y ago
        1) well 1000 dollar per hour seems like a non-reasonable price. 2) one should have a legal right to command a MRI scan without paid analysis.
        deleted 4y ago
        [deleted]
        JumpCrisscross 4y ago
        > 1000 dollar per hour seems like a non-reasonable price MRIs are expensive machinery that take highly-trained and well-paid technicians to maintain and operate. The imaging process takes an hour alone; start to finish, it's a two-hour process that is far from just pushing a button. > one should have a legal right to command a MRI scan without paid analysis I don't think there is a law, in America, prohibiting MRIs without expert analysis. But one, that's useless. And two, the people who don't think it's useless are the ones most likely to misinterpret the data and cause problems for the MRI provider.
        AnIdiotOnTheNet 4y ago
        > Google Query: cost of an MRI in India > Result: How much does an MRI scan cost in India? The average cost of MRI scan in India is usually between Rs. 1500 to Rs. 25000. > Query: Rs. 25000 in US dollars > Result: 25,000 Indian Rupee equals 321.02 United States Dollar ...so ok, there's a chance the first answer is wrong and/or there's some factor I'm missing, but assuming it isn't one must again ask the question: Why does an MRI cost $5k? For the record, asking specifically about a full body scan did not change the price: > Query: cost of an full body MRI in India > Result: [...] And the full-body scan cost you between INR 18000 to INR 25000 in India.

AlphaOne1 4y ago

The question that needs to asked though is: what would you do with that information? Would you be willing to undergo biopsy (which is the standard for diagnosis) knowing there is a non-zero risk of complication. What if the biopsy is not conclusive? Do we then do a major surgery which includes risk of death? Imaging is NOT diagnostic for tumors. For most lesions, you have to take tissue samples. Disclosure: I'm a pathologist.

SemanticStrengh 4y ago
> what would you do with that information? Well for starters anyone should check he has the right number of each organ, and at the right place (not ectoplasmic), and that their shape and volume is not pathologic. You should also check your bones joints to check wether you have metallic accumulation or not. It's not just about tumors. In any cases, there are generally many possibles diagnosises that do not involve a biopsy, such as blood/urine/lymph/fecal biomarkers, and DNA testing. In some cases you might even consider biofluorescence. Secondly, if a thing look like a tumor, I would study the risk and if very low I would proceed for a biopsy (risk seems OK) or otherwise use anticarcinogenic drugs. I would not proceed to a risky surgery unless necessary though, especially in an era where potent anticarcinogenic exists such as PNC-27 BTW it's very cool that this is a thing> https://www.nlm.nih.gov/research/visible/getting_data.html https://www.nlm.nih.gov/research/visible/getting_data.html

bsder 4y ago

> Full-body radiography/scan. Because many humans have bugs/anomalies that are mild/non-issues but are ambiguous and anxiety prone. These scans aren't magic. Most of the time you need a "contrast agent" to find things. That means an injection (and attendant infection risk) and circulation of a strange substance in your body. In the case of Gadolinium, there's about a 1 in 1000 reaction risk. So, you don't want to go injecting that into people without a good reason.