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Sure, CICO definitely applies, but so what? The first derivative of stored calories doesn't tell you anything interesting about causes. Your bank balance is a
by zamfi 4y ago
Sure, CICO definitely applies, but so what? The first derivative of stored calories doesn't tell you anything interesting about causes.
Your bank balance is a sum of money coming and and money going out, but what causes money coming in and what causes money going out are much more useful to anyone trying to earn wealth or avoid debt than the mere fact that your bank balance is their sum.
Like you, many people are convinced that the issue is "willpower / intellect". But this doesn't share a causal relationship with CICO! The willpower argument is like saying "oh yeah, to become rich, just earn more than you spend!" -- sure, that's true, and then someone says "ok, how do I do that?"; if your answer is "willpower!" I doubt they'll find that very satisfying.
Since I suspect you didn't read the post either, I'll excerpt two questions here:
(1) Rates of obesity in lab rats -- whose diets haven't changed -- have also increased over the last 50 years. Do they lack willpower too?
(2) Average calorie consumption hasn't changed much over the last 50 years, and nor has calorie expenditure. Average weight gain is in fact super slow, on the order of a few pounds per year, for most obese individuals. That's the equivalent of overeating by ~7000 calories each year -- only 1% of typical annual consumption. It's hard to imagine that people don't have the willpower to reduce their food consumption by 20 calories per day. Losing weight by keeping up a caloric deficit requires a ton of willpower because your body super fights against starvation. But why would a lack of willpower be the reason people perpetually eat 1% too many calories? And why did they only start doing that 50 years ago?
CICO is not a useful causal explanation for the obesity epidemic. Obesity at the societal level is a more interesting problem than merely CICO, despite how many people think the reason is some variant of willpower.
- rajin444 4y agoI read enough. > (1) Rates of obesity in lab rats -- whose diets haven't changed -- have also increased over the last 50 years. Do they lack willpower too? There are so many explanations for this outside of "some environmental factor causing everyone to get fat" that I don't think it needs explaining. > Average calorie consumption hasn't changed much over the last 50 years, and nor has calorie expenditure The methods for estimating these are likely wildly off. At face value, this would be an incredibly difficult statistic to obtain accurately. Nearly impossible. I'd need access to more data than is available to trust such a tremendous claim. Trying to simplify complex data like this is borderline pseudoscience. That being said, I'm not saying CICO is the casual explanation. I'm saying we have a large surplus of resources, and humans are designed to consume. Overcoming that drive is likely beyond many people.
- zamfi 4y ago> I'm saying we have a large surplus of resources, and humans are designed to consume. You have no particular evidence of this either. In other contexts where humans have had a large surplus of resources, there has not been an obesity epidemic.
- rajin444 4y agoCan you point to other contexts with an equivalent level of surplus of today? Even if you could, our science is not advanced enough to control for all the confounds. You can’t point to “evidence” or “science” to prove your point because we are not advanced enough to accurately claim anything at the level you’re attempting to. Research like you’re referencing is great for “this is interesting” and not “this is why the world works this way”.
- zamfi 4y ago> Research like you’re referencing is great for “this is interesting” and not “this is why the world works this way”. You clearly didn’t read enough — the whole point of the piece I referenced is “this is interesting” and not “this is why the world works this way”. Glad you finally agree that it’s great, though.
- ClumsyPilot 4y ago> There are so many explanations for this outside of "some environmental factor causing everyone to get fat" that I don't think it needs explaining. Do you not realise that this point alone jeopardizes your entire argument? If this effect is real, the rest of this discussion belongs straight in the trash. So yes, very much needs explaining.
- rajin444 4y agoYes, that’s my point. Parent is trying to “appeal to authority” essentially. We’re both arguing with no evidence, but parent is trying to act like they aren’t.