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My concern is with all the infants. Being able to gawk out and stare at all the many faces you see, and how they respond to you has got to be foundational to yo

My concern is with all the infants. Being able to gawk out and stare at all the many faces you see, and how they respond to you has got to be foundational to your discovery of the world. If had to place a bet on a major "net negative" I'm going all in on this. I have one friend who absolutely swears that "covid babies" are a thing, and that you can spot them from across the room. I haven't yet figured out what that means, but I tend to believe her. So not sure I can really quality/quantify it, but just like this article, maybe someone will try and an article with a catchy title will be written about it.

snowwrestler 4y ago
Infants basically ignore strangers or have mild interest in them. Infant eyesight is not good for distance; their perception is also in its infancy (their eyes detect photons but their brains are still learning to interpret the signals); their attention is correlated more strongly to sound than vision because sound is what they get in the womb. I mention strangers because the immediate caregivers of infants were generally not wearing masks around them most of the time even during the depths of the pandemic. Your friend is most likely engaged in motivated reasoning via confirmation bias; they are seeing what they expect and want to see. Infants in general often look spaced out or alarmed. Their facial expressions should not be taken to infer internal emotional state comparable to what an adult feels. Infant brains don’t yet work like adult brains. In addition, it’s not like COVID-19 is the first time human babies have been exposed to masks. Mask-wearing in public has been normal in some Asian cultures for decades, and of course some Muslim women cover their faces at all times outside the home.
- mr-wendel 4y ago
  Cheers, thanks for the extra points to consider. It's not an idea I'm committed to -- just concerned about it, so that helps!
px43 4y ago
I've got a covid baby, born June 2020. We're lucky enough that she was able to start school at 3 months old, and since then basically every adult she's interacted with (excluding us parents, but including grandparents) has been masked. These days her and her classmates are starting to wear their masks more often, but it's not fully required until she's 2. She seems well adjusted, social, super playful, and loves exploring the world as much as any kid I've ever known. I also grew up in the era where you were never ever supposed to use your real name or upload pictures of your face to the internet, and have absolute disdain for this weird webcam culture where people insist on seeing each-other's faces while interacting with them.I think the rise in racism and other forms of hatred on the internet ties directly to the increase in people making photographs of themselves central to their identity. I'm actually kind of hoping her generation grows up with less emphasis on appearance. Maybe we have a couple years here with a few less narcissists. Only good things can come out of such developments IMO.
- verisimi 4y ago
  > We're lucky enough that she was able to start school at 3 months old Lucky for who?
danShumway 4y ago
> I have one friend who absolutely swears that "covid babies" are a thing, and that you can spot them from across the room. I don't dismiss this out of hand, it is at least somewhat plausible to me that less facial exposure might impact infant development. However, I can also probably spot a covid baby at least somewhat reliably across the room, because I'd just look for any baby that's seems like they're less than 2-3 years old, so I'm not certain that being able to do so reveals very much.
- the_sleaze9 4y ago
  Totally agreed. I can also spot a Trump baby across the room, which is obviously totally different than a Biden baby. I'll take the liberty of not revealing my meaning either, of course.
the_sleaze9 4y ago
As a parent in the thick of babies exactly at this age and surrounded by other parents in the same situation, I cannot tell the difference between a "covid" baby and any other. What I can tell you is how much time and effort the parents are putting into the baby, and whether is home-schooled or goes to school/daycare. First child? They're probably walking early. Third kid? They'll be pushing a year and a half old with barely 5 words in their repertoire and I'll consider them lucky if they can hold themselves upright using a chair for support. The parents with 3 young kids just don't have the bandwidth to provide the kind of attention that the baby needs. I essentially think about it this way - consider how much information AlphaGo has to learn with. Now consider how much information your brain processes with only your vision. You think there's gonna be a statistically relevant causation because there's a piece of fabric on the adult's face? I can't say for certain, but from my daily sampling it's much less than you intuitively would think. Kids are resilient and motivated to learn.
- mr-wendel 4y ago
  Also good points to consider. The parental investment factor probably is a much more dominant factor in the equation too. Curiosity and resilience too. And thanks for a charitable understanding of the "covid baby" idea: obviously "all babies right now are covid babies" so this is a comparison of "pre-covid" vs "now" (and that early on, that line was much blurrier).
escalt 4y ago
Every baby right now is a "covid baby", so of course they're easy to spot

snowwrestler 4y ago

Infants basically ignore strangers or have mild interest in them. Infant eyesight is not good for distance; their perception is also in its infancy (their eyes detect photons but their brains are still learning to interpret the signals); their attention is correlated more strongly to sound than vision because sound is what they get in the womb. I mention strangers because the immediate caregivers of infants were generally not wearing masks around them most of the time even during the depths of the pandemic. Your friend is most likely engaged in motivated reasoning via confirmation bias; they are seeing what they expect and want to see. Infants in general often look spaced out or alarmed. Their facial expressions should not be taken to infer internal emotional state comparable to what an adult feels. Infant brains don’t yet work like adult brains. In addition, it’s not like COVID-19 is the first time human babies have been exposed to masks. Mask-wearing in public has been normal in some Asian cultures for decades, and of course some Muslim women cover their faces at all times outside the home.

mr-wendel 4y ago
Cheers, thanks for the extra points to consider. It's not an idea I'm committed to -- just concerned about it, so that helps!

px43 4y ago

I've got a covid baby, born June 2020. We're lucky enough that she was able to start school at 3 months old, and since then basically every adult she's interacted with (excluding us parents, but including grandparents) has been masked. These days her and her classmates are starting to wear their masks more often, but it's not fully required until she's 2. She seems well adjusted, social, super playful, and loves exploring the world as much as any kid I've ever known. I also grew up in the era where you were never ever supposed to use your real name or upload pictures of your face to the internet, and have absolute disdain for this weird webcam culture where people insist on seeing each-other's faces while interacting with them.I think the rise in racism and other forms of hatred on the internet ties directly to the increase in people making photographs of themselves central to their identity. I'm actually kind of hoping her generation grows up with less emphasis on appearance. Maybe we have a couple years here with a few less narcissists. Only good things can come out of such developments IMO.

verisimi 4y ago
> We're lucky enough that she was able to start school at 3 months old Lucky for who?

danShumway 4y ago

> I have one friend who absolutely swears that "covid babies" are a thing, and that you can spot them from across the room. I don't dismiss this out of hand, it is at least somewhat plausible to me that less facial exposure might impact infant development. However, I can also probably spot a covid baby at least somewhat reliably across the room, because I'd just look for any baby that's seems like they're less than 2-3 years old, so I'm not certain that being able to do so reveals very much.

the_sleaze9 4y ago
Totally agreed. I can also spot a Trump baby across the room, which is obviously totally different than a Biden baby. I'll take the liberty of not revealing my meaning either, of course.

the_sleaze9 4y ago

As a parent in the thick of babies exactly at this age and surrounded by other parents in the same situation, I cannot tell the difference between a "covid" baby and any other. What I can tell you is how much time and effort the parents are putting into the baby, and whether is home-schooled or goes to school/daycare. First child? They're probably walking early. Third kid? They'll be pushing a year and a half old with barely 5 words in their repertoire and I'll consider them lucky if they can hold themselves upright using a chair for support. The parents with 3 young kids just don't have the bandwidth to provide the kind of attention that the baby needs. I essentially think about it this way - consider how much information AlphaGo has to learn with. Now consider how much information your brain processes with only your vision. You think there's gonna be a statistically relevant causation because there's a piece of fabric on the adult's face? I can't say for certain, but from my daily sampling it's much less than you intuitively would think. Kids are resilient and motivated to learn.

mr-wendel 4y ago
Also good points to consider. The parental investment factor probably is a much more dominant factor in the equation too. Curiosity and resilience too. And thanks for a charitable understanding of the "covid baby" idea: obviously "all babies right now are covid babies" so this is a comparison of "pre-covid" vs "now" (and that early on, that line was much blurrier).

escalt 4y ago

Every baby right now is a "covid baby", so of course they're easy to spot