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> What does that have to do with its status as a country? Generally in a country you would expect to find some people (not necessarily the majority) who believ

> What does that have to do with its status as a country? Generally in a country you would expect to find some people (not necessarily the majority) who believe in the idea of that country as an independent, sovereign nation. Northern Ireland doesn’t have that. The vast majority of people in Northern Ireland want it to either be part of UK or of Ireland, and to the extent an independence movement exists it’s notable only for how incredibly un-popular it is. Why does it matter? Because if the population of a putative “country” don’t in fact see it as a country but rather as a territory of somewhere else, then the “country” descriptor would appear to have been externally applied.

logifail 4y ago
> The vast majority of people in Northern Ireland want it to either be part of UK or of Ireland, and to the extent an independence movement exists it’s notable only for how incredibly un-popular it is I wonder what the mainland thinks? On that theme, I've ever pondered would happen if one were to hold a referendum in England, Wales and Northern Ireland about Scotland leaving the UK and becoming a sovereign state. Not least because of the Barnett formula[0], asking the Scots what they think of independence is surely only part of the puzzle. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barnett_formula https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barnett_formula
maccard 4y ago
You've built your own definition of a country there, and it's such a dated definition of a country even Wikipedia straight up disagrees with you [0]. When talking about NI in particular, the rules are flexed but there is no doubt that it is not a requirement for a country to be an independent sovereign nation. > the “country” descriptor would appear to have been externally applied. You've made two generous leaps here - that the population don't consider it to be a country, and that the fact that an externally applied label on a state is invalid. It's incredibly dismissive of you to think that the people of NI don't think of it as country for a dtart, but your second point is just plain wrong. I can call Crimea a disputed territory with confidence, despite Russia claiming it's independent, for example. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Country https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Country

logifail 4y ago

> The vast majority of people in Northern Ireland want it to either be part of UK or of Ireland, and to the extent an independence movement exists it’s notable only for how incredibly un-popular it is I wonder what the mainland thinks? On that theme, I've ever pondered would happen if one were to hold a referendum in England, Wales and Northern Ireland about Scotland leaving the UK and becoming a sovereign state. Not least because of the Barnett formula[0], asking the Scots what they think of independence is surely only part of the puzzle. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barnett_formula https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barnett_formula

maccard 4y ago

You've built your own definition of a country there, and it's such a dated definition of a country even Wikipedia straight up disagrees with you [0]. When talking about NI in particular, the rules are flexed but there is no doubt that it is not a requirement for a country to be an independent sovereign nation. > the “country” descriptor would appear to have been externally applied. You've made two generous leaps here - that the population don't consider it to be a country, and that the fact that an externally applied label on a state is invalid. It's incredibly dismissive of you to think that the people of NI don't think of it as country for a dtart, but your second point is just plain wrong. I can call Crimea a disputed territory with confidence, despite Russia claiming it's independent, for example. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Country https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Country