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I agree on your points about Ethereum and all alt-coins. Bitcoin is another matter though, because it has the majority hash rate. Please note that bitcoin minin

I agree on your points about Ethereum and all alt-coins. Bitcoin is another matter though, because it has the majority hash rate. Please note that bitcoin mining is a fraction of a fraction of all energy use in the world, and as an industry, well ahead of its peers in terms of green energy usage. Using electricity is not a problem; carbon emission are, and there a a very substantial number of other industries that are in orders of magnitude worse to our environment (among which is gold mining, clothes dying and disposable plastics). Using electricity to separate money and state is well worth the cost to me. edit: bring forth thy downvotes, HN.

rollcat 4y ago
> Please note that bitcoin mining is a fraction of a fraction of all energy use in the world A fraction of a fraction is still a fraction. If you're going to make an argument about actual energy usage, please quote actual numbers. > [...] as an industry, well ahead of its peers in terms of green energy usage. Bitcoin is not an industry. An industry has a product or service. Bitcoin's "service" is subsidising greed and speculation using natural resources - at the expense of everyone else. Blockchain, as a data structure, is a solution in search of a problem. So far the only "value" I'm seeing is runaway speculation. It does not matter which source of energy Bitcoin is using, it's fundamentally still based on the premise of proof of waste. It doesn't matter that it's "green", the same green energy could have been used to burn less coal elsewhere; or we could've avoided building the power plants to begin with. Ethereum is at least trying to move to proof of stake, although they're consistently under-delivering. > [...] there a a very substantial number of other industries that are in orders of magnitude worse to our environment [...] This is very true. But what is also true, is that another actor being worse doesn't justify your endeavor's own crimes. Just because your neighbor is beating their partner, doesn't mean you can kick a stray cat. > Using electricity to separate money and state is well worth the cost to me. And that's exactly what is wrong with proof of waste: it's worth the cost to *you*. You've never asked *me*, if it's OK for you to destroy the planet that *I* am also living on, let alone if I share your views on how noble the goal is. Separating money and state sounds like a bold wish. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29322172#29323906 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29322172#29323906 Please don't take this comment as an attempt at a personal attack - I have no way of knowing your actual stake, what I'm trying to protest is the game itself. > edit: bring forth thy downvotes, HN. Don't worry, they're coming to both sides. I would always prefer to see arguments rather than downvotes, so thank you for taking a stance.

rollcat 4y ago

> Please note that bitcoin mining is a fraction of a fraction of all energy use in the world A fraction of a fraction is still a fraction. If you're going to make an argument about actual energy usage, please quote actual numbers. > [...] as an industry, well ahead of its peers in terms of green energy usage. Bitcoin is not an industry. An industry has a product or service. Bitcoin's "service" is subsidising greed and speculation using natural resources - at the expense of everyone else. Blockchain, as a data structure, is a solution in search of a problem. So far the only "value" I'm seeing is runaway speculation. It does not matter which source of energy Bitcoin is using, it's fundamentally still based on the premise of proof of waste. It doesn't matter that it's "green", the same green energy could have been used to burn less coal elsewhere; or we could've avoided building the power plants to begin with. Ethereum is at least trying to move to proof of stake, although they're consistently under-delivering. > [...] there a a very substantial number of other industries that are in orders of magnitude worse to our environment [...] This is very true. But what is also true, is that another actor being worse doesn't justify your endeavor's own crimes. Just because your neighbor is beating their partner, doesn't mean you can kick a stray cat. > Using electricity to separate money and state is well worth the cost to me. And that's exactly what is wrong with proof of waste: it's worth the cost to *you*. You've never asked *me*, if it's OK for you to destroy the planet that *I* am also living on, let alone if I share your views on how noble the goal is. Separating money and state sounds like a bold wish. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29322172#29323906 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29322172#29323906 Please don't take this comment as an attempt at a personal attack - I have no way of knowing your actual stake, what I'm trying to protest is the game itself. > edit: bring forth thy downvotes, HN. Don't worry, they're coming to both sides. I would always prefer to see arguments rather than downvotes, so thank you for taking a stance.