4 ms·

By invading Ukraine. LOL.

by temp8964 4y ago

Consultant32452 4y ago
- golergka 4y ago
  I'm not sure how is that relevant here? Because if you're trying to say that US is to blame for this war, here's the newsflash: causal relationships and moral responsibility are not the same thing. Even if you knowingly provoke a criminal to do a crime (for example, by leaving your home unlocked, or by going around a bad neighbourhood in very sexy clothing), it does not in any way absolve him of decision to do the crime.
  - Consultant32452 4y ago
    The world is not simple good guys vs bad guys. Often it's bad guys vs bad guys.
    - golergka 4y ago
      Painting everyone with the same shade of gray is a more simplistic view of the world, not less.
      - Consultant32452 4y ago
        In the last 25 years, which country in the world has invaded the most countries and slaughtered the most people in those countries they invaded? NATO/US is a far greater risk to the world than Russia, even if you might think Putin the person is more evil than Biden the person.
        golergka 4y ago
        > invaded If we're talking about moral side of thins, then this word should be read as "unjustifiably invaded, violating international law" and US haven't actually done it once in the last 25 years. > NATO/US is a far greater risk to the world Only if you invade your neighbours that have defence treaties with US or partake in genocide. Not something that I, or anyone else, minds.
        Consultant32452 4y ago
        Did you know the US is partaking in a genocide in Yemen as we speak? And committing war crimes with cluster bombs to boot.
- rmind 4y ago
  The very concept of a nuclear country being "pushed" (what does that even mean?) to wage a war against a country, which is more than 3x smaller in population and around 5x weaker economically, is simply delusional. Russia attempted to wage a 19th century style conquest: brutal and open territorial grab including the subjugation and repression of the local population.
  - mcv 4y ago
    Yeah, when you have that much more power (or at least believe to), it's more about opportunity. Russia had an opportunity to invade because Ukraine was not part of NATO yet, and probably had rebuilt their forces (they seem to be waging a war every 6-8 years). Any attempt to legitimize their attack by pointing to threats they imagine other countries pose to Russia, is easily countered by the very obvious and direct threat that Russia eagerly poses to other countries. Temporary neutrality is not going to fix this; in 8 years, they're going to try again. All neighbours of Russia would be wise to join a defensive alliance.
  - Consultant32452 4y ago
    The military funded think tank that prescribed all of our actions leading up to this point and accurately predicted Russia's responses disagrees with you. No one wants direct nuclear war, but they do want to skirt around the edges and expand their power. The US has been in multiple hot proxy wars with Russia, the biggest being the attempted overthrow of Syria. US leadership from both parties have publicly described Ukraine as a proxy war between the US and Russia. If you're still in the early days of the propaganda where Russia invaded Ukraine totally out of the blue with zero provocation from anyone and the US is just doing their best to protect the innocents, you're way behind.
    - rmind 4y ago
      Russia didn't invade Ukraine "out of the blue". Russia has been at war with Ukraine since 2014, when it occupied and annexed Crimea, and at the same time orchestrated and instigated covert War in Donbas. You ramble something incoherent about the RAND paper from 2019. Just to clarify this: yes, it is precisely where the defense research should have spent the money following the Russia's aggression.

By invading Ukraine. LOL.

Consultant32452 4y ago

golergka 4y ago
I'm not sure how is that relevant here? Because if you're trying to say that US is to blame for this war, here's the newsflash: causal relationships and moral responsibility are not the same thing. Even if you knowingly provoke a criminal to do a crime (for example, by leaving your home unlocked, or by going around a bad neighbourhood in very sexy clothing), it does not in any way absolve him of decision to do the crime.
- Consultant32452 4y ago
  The world is not simple good guys vs bad guys. Often it's bad guys vs bad guys.
  - golergka 4y ago
    Painting everyone with the same shade of gray is a more simplistic view of the world, not less.
    - Consultant32452 4y ago
      In the last 25 years, which country in the world has invaded the most countries and slaughtered the most people in those countries they invaded? NATO/US is a far greater risk to the world than Russia, even if you might think Putin the person is more evil than Biden the person.
      - golergka 4y ago
        > invaded If we're talking about moral side of thins, then this word should be read as "unjustifiably invaded, violating international law" and US haven't actually done it once in the last 25 years. > NATO/US is a far greater risk to the world Only if you invade your neighbours that have defence treaties with US or partake in genocide. Not something that I, or anyone else, minds.
        Consultant32452 4y ago
        Did you know the US is partaking in a genocide in Yemen as we speak? And committing war crimes with cluster bombs to boot.
rmind 4y ago
The very concept of a nuclear country being "pushed" (what does that even mean?) to wage a war against a country, which is more than 3x smaller in population and around 5x weaker economically, is simply delusional. Russia attempted to wage a 19th century style conquest: brutal and open territorial grab including the subjugation and repression of the local population.
- mcv 4y ago
  Yeah, when you have that much more power (or at least believe to), it's more about opportunity. Russia had an opportunity to invade because Ukraine was not part of NATO yet, and probably had rebuilt their forces (they seem to be waging a war every 6-8 years). Any attempt to legitimize their attack by pointing to threats they imagine other countries pose to Russia, is easily countered by the very obvious and direct threat that Russia eagerly poses to other countries. Temporary neutrality is not going to fix this; in 8 years, they're going to try again. All neighbours of Russia would be wise to join a defensive alliance.
- Consultant32452 4y ago
  The military funded think tank that prescribed all of our actions leading up to this point and accurately predicted Russia's responses disagrees with you. No one wants direct nuclear war, but they do want to skirt around the edges and expand their power. The US has been in multiple hot proxy wars with Russia, the biggest being the attempted overthrow of Syria. US leadership from both parties have publicly described Ukraine as a proxy war between the US and Russia. If you're still in the early days of the propaganda where Russia invaded Ukraine totally out of the blue with zero provocation from anyone and the US is just doing their best to protect the innocents, you're way behind.
  - rmind 4y ago
    Russia didn't invade Ukraine "out of the blue". Russia has been at war with Ukraine since 2014, when it occupied and annexed Crimea, and at the same time orchestrated and instigated covert War in Donbas. You ramble something incoherent about the RAND paper from 2019. Just to clarify this: yes, it is precisely where the defense research should have spent the money following the Russia's aggression.