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>If you're in a position of desperation, first get out of that position before you go to these interviews. You're contradicting yourself here. If you're hungry

>If you're in a position of desperation, first get out of that position before you go to these interviews. You're contradicting yourself here. If you're hungry, you don't have the leverage to get out of that position without first accepting some jobs you won't find ideal, unless you're incredibly lucky or talented or have huge savings, but if you were, you probably wouldn't be hungry in the first place.

VoodooJuJu 4y ago
I agree it's probably a contradiction to many people, as a job may be their only ticket out of desperation, especially if they're knee-deep in debt or living paycheck to paycheck. But I would wager many others do have options they can exercise such as becoming more frugal, cutting out rent by living with family, taking no-bullshit (no free work) wage jobs temporarily, etc.
- mattcwilson 4y ago
  Sure. Except it’s the easier, more impulsive choice to just do the take home work on the off chance it gets you the job and lets you skip all the austerity. Path of least resistance is a powerful predictor of human behavior.
Ancapistani 4y ago
I've done a couple of these. Once, I did the take-home assignment, which took around six hours. I submitted it by linking to a public GitHub repo titled "Company X Take Home Assignment". I ended up taking a different position and the original company asked that I take down the repo. I told them that since I did the work on my own time, I own the resultant code and declined to take it down. They sent me a nastygram from their in-house lawyer. I responded with an invoice for $900 - six hours at $150 / hour. That got me a phone call scheduled with their lawyer. I figured they either owned the code (in which case, they should pay for it) or I owned the code (in which case, they had no legal right to demand that I take it down). The next day they sent me $500 over PayPal and I took it down.
- olsonjeffery 4y ago
  Based on my experience and since you mention it, the only thing they were responding to was the fact that you put the company’s name in your code base. There’s probably also a good chance that their take-home instructions specifically say NOT to do this. Whether or not you’re “right” about ownership (whatever this means), to me you just sound like a jerk.
  - Ancapistani 4y ago
    > Based on my experience and since you mention it, the only thing they were responding to was the fact that you put the company’s name in your code base. Correct. > There’s probably also a good chance that their take-home instructions specifically say NOT to do this. Also correct. I disregarded it. > Whether or not you’re “right” about ownership (whatever this means), to me you just sound like a jerk. Perhaps. I wouldn’t even argue that it wasn’t an asshole thing to do. I would argue that it’s no more of an asshole thing to do than to require someone to perform six hours of unpaid work. From their perspective, it was easier to pay me than it would have been to pay their attorney to take me to court or to pay their engineers to come up with a new take-home assignment so the “answer” wasn’t just a Google search away. “Being a jerk” is just acting in a way that’s contrary to the prevailing cultural norms. I believe this particular norm is harmful, and don’t mind being called a jerk to challenge it.

VoodooJuJu 4y ago

I agree it's probably a contradiction to many people, as a job may be their only ticket out of desperation, especially if they're knee-deep in debt or living paycheck to paycheck. But I would wager many others do have options they can exercise such as becoming more frugal, cutting out rent by living with family, taking no-bullshit (no free work) wage jobs temporarily, etc.

mattcwilson 4y ago
Sure. Except it’s the easier, more impulsive choice to just do the take home work on the off chance it gets you the job and lets you skip all the austerity. Path of least resistance is a powerful predictor of human behavior.

Ancapistani 4y ago

I've done a couple of these. Once, I did the take-home assignment, which took around six hours. I submitted it by linking to a public GitHub repo titled "Company X Take Home Assignment". I ended up taking a different position and the original company asked that I take down the repo. I told them that since I did the work on my own time, I own the resultant code and declined to take it down. They sent me a nastygram from their in-house lawyer. I responded with an invoice for $900 - six hours at $150 / hour. That got me a phone call scheduled with their lawyer. I figured they either owned the code (in which case, they should pay for it) or I owned the code (in which case, they had no legal right to demand that I take it down). The next day they sent me $500 over PayPal and I took it down.

olsonjeffery 4y ago
Based on my experience and since you mention it, the only thing they were responding to was the fact that you put the company’s name in your code base. There’s probably also a good chance that their take-home instructions specifically say NOT to do this. Whether or not you’re “right” about ownership (whatever this means), to me you just sound like a jerk.
- Ancapistani 4y ago
  > Based on my experience and since you mention it, the only thing they were responding to was the fact that you put the company’s name in your code base. Correct. > There’s probably also a good chance that their take-home instructions specifically say NOT to do this. Also correct. I disregarded it. > Whether or not you’re “right” about ownership (whatever this means), to me you just sound like a jerk. Perhaps. I wouldn’t even argue that it wasn’t an asshole thing to do. I would argue that it’s no more of an asshole thing to do than to require someone to perform six hours of unpaid work. From their perspective, it was easier to pay me than it would have been to pay their attorney to take me to court or to pay their engineers to come up with a new take-home assignment so the “answer” wasn’t just a Google search away. “Being a jerk” is just acting in a way that’s contrary to the prevailing cultural norms. I believe this particular norm is harmful, and don’t mind being called a jerk to challenge it.