4 ms·

It is funny because people who are unemployed are shamed for being "unproductive members of society", yet when you get out into the real world, you see all of t

It is funny because people who are unemployed are shamed for being "unproductive members of society", yet when you get out into the real world, you see all of these people doing nothing and getting paid lots of money, which is even worse than being unemployed in that context. Anyway, it seems there is just a lot of money to go around and political and social favours dominate a lot of the decisions.

ethbr0 4y ago
Free market capitalism is the least efficient allocator of work and pay, except for all the others.
- t-3 4y ago
  Free market communism is probably more efficient, it just requires the kind of socioeconomic conditions that attract invasions from capitalists.
  - ethbr0 4y ago
    Free market communism as in? Free market economy with communist political system and allocation? Trying to parse your definition of the term, as it seems like any definition for communism disrupts the feedback mechanism that is a free market's primary (only?) advantage.
    - lupire 4y ago
      Free/Libre software is free market communism. It's a free market but with the financial incentive system removed, but maybe social/status/religious incentive retained. Everyone does what they want but at 100% tax rate and the product is shared. Of course this only works in IP because it has zero marginal cost of consumption (and taxation!). In meat space you have the political problem of how the fruits of labor are distributed.
      - Jensson 4y ago
        Who pays the developers of said software so they don't starve? The state? Then the state will decide what projects gets traction, such centralized planning is the main reason communism fails. Software engineers would then be more like scientists having to spend most of their time writing grant requests to motivate why they should get any pay, I really doubt this would give society better software compared to the current free market solution.
        gmm1990 4y ago
        you could have a ubi system and then add incentives for devs on open source products that are used. Just a thought, I'm sure there would be corruption of this system too
        ethbr0 4y ago
        Or the same thing, slightly differently, who uses FOSS? For-profit companies. I think history has born out how FOSS incentives get entangled with a primary and majority patron.
    - t-3 4y ago
      Not all communism is authoritarian/statist. "Libertarian communism" (sometimes known as anarchy) is socialist while allowing freedom of association and economic self-determinism. Historically, it has been strongly linked to the concept of republicanism and unions.
      - ethbr0 4y ago
        What part of it is most socialist? (Honestly asking and curious, I'm terribly ignorant in the more niche -isms of potential political-economic organization)
        t-3 4y ago
        It's socialist in the sense of promoting mutual aid and communalism. The union movement was originally very influenced by these ideas. Unions, co-ops, FOSS projects, and community organizations are good examples of these type of political/economic structures. If you're interested, Peter Kropotkin wrote a lot of books and pamphlets that are freely available.

ethbr0 4y ago

Free market capitalism is the least efficient allocator of work and pay, except for all the others.

t-3 4y ago
Free market communism is probably more efficient, it just requires the kind of socioeconomic conditions that attract invasions from capitalists.
- ethbr0 4y ago
  Free market communism as in? Free market economy with communist political system and allocation? Trying to parse your definition of the term, as it seems like any definition for communism disrupts the feedback mechanism that is a free market's primary (only?) advantage.
  - lupire 4y ago
    Free/Libre software is free market communism. It's a free market but with the financial incentive system removed, but maybe social/status/religious incentive retained. Everyone does what they want but at 100% tax rate and the product is shared. Of course this only works in IP because it has zero marginal cost of consumption (and taxation!). In meat space you have the political problem of how the fruits of labor are distributed.
    - Jensson 4y ago
      Who pays the developers of said software so they don't starve? The state? Then the state will decide what projects gets traction, such centralized planning is the main reason communism fails. Software engineers would then be more like scientists having to spend most of their time writing grant requests to motivate why they should get any pay, I really doubt this would give society better software compared to the current free market solution.
      - gmm1990 4y ago
        you could have a ubi system and then add incentives for devs on open source products that are used. Just a thought, I'm sure there would be corruption of this system too
      - ethbr0 4y ago
        Or the same thing, slightly differently, who uses FOSS? For-profit companies. I think history has born out how FOSS incentives get entangled with a primary and majority patron.
  - t-3 4y ago
    Not all communism is authoritarian/statist. "Libertarian communism" (sometimes known as anarchy) is socialist while allowing freedom of association and economic self-determinism. Historically, it has been strongly linked to the concept of republicanism and unions.
    - ethbr0 4y ago
      What part of it is most socialist? (Honestly asking and curious, I'm terribly ignorant in the more niche -isms of potential political-economic organization)
      - t-3 4y ago
        It's socialist in the sense of promoting mutual aid and communalism. The union movement was originally very influenced by these ideas. Unions, co-ops, FOSS projects, and community organizations are good examples of these type of political/economic structures. If you're interested, Peter Kropotkin wrote a lot of books and pamphlets that are freely available.