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I thought IQ tests were pseudoscientific anyway? If the number doesnt have any rigorous meaning then who cares if it changes, up or down, could mean anything.

BlargMcLarg 4y ago
IQ tests can be trained for and gamed, at the very least.
- ryan93 4y ago
  no one does. there are orders of magnitude more studying for the SAT and studying for the sat has a marginal benefit for many
  - BlargMcLarg 4y ago
    Europe doesn't use SAT. I concede most people don't actively train for IQ tests, especially not people who only have to do it once. But one can't exactly claim "IQ tests are flawless measures of IQ" when they can be trained and gamed, which is the point.
    - ryan93 4y ago
      But the scores that psychologists use in their studies weren’t collected from people who trained for the IQ exam. Almost impossible to find out what they ask on exams since they are sold directly to practitioners.
xupybd 4y ago
They're a good proxy for abstract ability.
jjgreen 4y ago
They're a great measure of intelligence -- if you believe in them, you're an idiot.
annyeonghada 4y ago
>I thought IQ tests were pseudoscientific anyway? This is false. Look a this reddit post[1] for a summary of the scientific consensus. [1]https://www.reddit.com/r/slatestarcodex/comments/oh6115/performance_on_standardized_assessments_of/ https://www.reddit.com/r/slatestarcodex/comments/oh6115/perf...
- everyone 4y ago
  You seem very certain. Several of the links in that wall o' text are merely to surveys where a number of psychologists are asked whether they think IQ is a valid measure or not. The reddit post just shows that some (maybe even a majority of) psychologists accept IQ. I could post an equal amount of links to psychology studies rejecting it. But that doesn't even matter. What's more important is that the field of psychology as a whole is still in it's infancy as a science. Up until about the 90's almost 100% of it was pure bunk. Psychologists were using the DSM up until only a couple of years ago! Recently there has been the revelation of the reproducibility crisis. In short, psychology has a long way to go before it's on the same level as other sciences, I wouldn't be so certain of something from psychology's dark past like IQ.
bigbacaloa 4y ago
People who score well on them are usually convinced they are scientific.

BlargMcLarg 4y ago

IQ tests can be trained for and gamed, at the very least.

ryan93 4y ago
no one does. there are orders of magnitude more studying for the SAT and studying for the sat has a marginal benefit for many
- BlargMcLarg 4y ago
  Europe doesn't use SAT. I concede most people don't actively train for IQ tests, especially not people who only have to do it once. But one can't exactly claim "IQ tests are flawless measures of IQ" when they can be trained and gamed, which is the point.
  - ryan93 4y ago
    But the scores that psychologists use in their studies weren’t collected from people who trained for the IQ exam. Almost impossible to find out what they ask on exams since they are sold directly to practitioners.

xupybd 4y ago

They're a good proxy for abstract ability.

jjgreen 4y ago

They're a great measure of intelligence -- if you believe in them, you're an idiot.

annyeonghada 4y ago

>I thought IQ tests were pseudoscientific anyway? This is false. Look a this reddit post[1] for a summary of the scientific consensus. [1]https://www.reddit.com/r/slatestarcodex/comments/oh6115/performance_on_standardized_assessments_of/ https://www.reddit.com/r/slatestarcodex/comments/oh6115/perf...

everyone 4y ago
You seem very certain. Several of the links in that wall o' text are merely to surveys where a number of psychologists are asked whether they think IQ is a valid measure or not. The reddit post just shows that some (maybe even a majority of) psychologists accept IQ. I could post an equal amount of links to psychology studies rejecting it. But that doesn't even matter. What's more important is that the field of psychology as a whole is still in it's infancy as a science. Up until about the 90's almost 100% of it was pure bunk. Psychologists were using the DSM up until only a couple of years ago! Recently there has been the revelation of the reproducibility crisis. In short, psychology has a long way to go before it's on the same level as other sciences, I wouldn't be so certain of something from psychology's dark past like IQ.

bigbacaloa 4y ago

People who score well on them are usually convinced they are scientific.