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You make some good points, and I'd venture to guess that you're handy with a bike, but for the vast majority of people who use bikes, what you're saying about m

You make some good points, and I'd venture to guess that you're handy with a bike, but for the vast majority of people who use bikes, what you're saying about maintenance is totally irrelevant. I'm also handy with a bike, and I've spent some time volunteering fixing up used bikes for resale. Here's what I usually saw: > Chains wear out and require replacement, usually together with the rear sprockets. Front rings wear also; about once every three times you change a rear sprocket, you have to change the front rings which, for entry level bikes is usually most cheaply done by getting the entire crank set. This is true, but very, very few bikes ever get the kind of miles put on them to wear out a chain. If you ever wear out a chain, you're conservatively in the top 3% of cyclists by miles ridden. Mostly chains die a slow horrible death by being left outside all winter and turning entirely into a rusty immovable mess. If they're completely beyond saving, you cut them off with a hacksaw, put on a new one, check the cassette, and move in to the next neglected thing. I've never replaced a cassette other than on my own bike, no matter how nice or shabby the bike looked. In the extraordinarily unlikely case that somebody manages to wear out the chain on a cheap bike, they're almost certainly as well off just buying a new cheap bike. Everything on a cheap bike is crap, and by the time you've killed a chain, something else will need to be fixed. Unless the labor is free (mine was, that was the point), you're quickly into more money to polish a turd than to buy a new one. If by "entry level", you mean "inexpensive from an actual bike shop", then yeah, it might be worth replacing some drivetrain components. Even so, you'd be dealing with the unicorn rider who rides enough to wear out a chain, but also doesn't want to upgrade to a midrange bike. > Typically, a multi-speed rear cassette must be removed in order to replace a broken spoke, which is a PITA. This is because it is larger than the hub, and is right next to it, blocking access to the spoke entry holes on the drive side. You need chain whip to prevent the hub from turning... I've broken and replaced spokes. It's pretty rare, and it requires special tools. Most cyclists can't adjust a derailleur, and a surprisingly large number are incapable of fixing a flat. Everything you're saying is true, but for nearly everybody, a broken spoke is a job for a bike shop. The barrier for replacing a spoke for most people isn't having the tools, it's knowing how to use them, and specifically how to re-true the wheel. I don't mean getting it perfect on a stand, I mean getting it rideable using the brake pads for a reference. I know somebody who used to race competitively. He has a shop do all his maintenance because he's not even the slightest bit handy, and I can only assume it's not for the lack of opportunity to learn while he was riding competitively.

kazinator 4y ago
Maintenance is not "totally irrelevant" to people who have someone else do it. > This is true, but very, very few bikes ever get the kind of miles put on them to wear out a chain. I suspect that is changing with e-bikes which are used for actual daily commuting. People buy those things to ride them. In my experience, daily commuting of around 20 km on a non-powered ordinary bike all year round requires a yearly chain replacement. You can get away with a once per two years cassette job. Now these e-bikes have serious torque and power. You regularly see them keeping up with cars going 50 km/h or more, even uphill. Yet may use use ordinary drive trains, such as entry-level Shimano cassettes, derailleurs and rings. The power of the motor can easily be expected to trash these components way faster than a human power. > In the extraordinarily unlikely case that somebody manages to wear out the chain on a cheap bike, they're almost certainly as well off just buying a new cheap bike. This is false, because chains cost something like $15-$30. Cheap chains and drive sets are still found on entry-level real bikes that might go for $600-$800 or whatever. You're not going to replace an $800 bike because of the chain. It wouldn't make sense to replace even a $100 bike-shaped-object if all it needs is a $15 chain. There was a time when I rode crap bikes; I still maintained them, and replaced the chain. > I've broken and replaced spokes. It's pretty rare. During my daily cycling era when I didn't have a car for some 8 years, I fixed about 3 broken spokes per year. Almost always on the drive side of the rear wheel. So while rarer than a flat tire, it's not that rare. I had no time for bike shops. They are too far away and have stupid hours like not opening until 10:30 on a weekday, and being closed Sundays. They will keep your bike for at least a day, and charge some ridiculous amount to change a part that costs a dollar. Truing a wheel is not difficult (particularly lateral-only truing), and once you go to disc brakes, perfection is less important. The bike can even be ridden for a few days with a broken spoke: you just have to clip it off, because you don't want a broken spoke flailing around. It's not a great idea to ride a wheel with a broken spoke, but lets you schedule a good time to fix it, if you're busy What I'd pay a shop to do would be axial truing: fixing the eccentricity of the wheel's circle. I asume that if I tell a shop to true a wheel, they are only going to care about left-right wobble, which "anyone" can do.
- mrob 4y ago
  >I fixed about 3 broken spokes per year. Almost always on the drive side of the rear wheel. This hints at one less obvious advantage of the drive system described in the article: no need for asymmetrical wheel dishing. Rear wheels for conventional derailleur systems have to be built asymmetrically[0]. This makes the wheel weaker than a symmetrical one, because the drive side spokes are under higher tension. I ride a hub gear bicycle with symmetrical wheels as my primary form of transport and I've never broken a spoke. Electric drive would allow the same wheel strength. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bicycle_wheel#Dish https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bicycle_wheel#Dish

kazinator 4y ago

Maintenance is not "totally irrelevant" to people who have someone else do it. > This is true, but very, very few bikes ever get the kind of miles put on them to wear out a chain. I suspect that is changing with e-bikes which are used for actual daily commuting. People buy those things to ride them. In my experience, daily commuting of around 20 km on a non-powered ordinary bike all year round requires a yearly chain replacement. You can get away with a once per two years cassette job. Now these e-bikes have serious torque and power. You regularly see them keeping up with cars going 50 km/h or more, even uphill. Yet may use use ordinary drive trains, such as entry-level Shimano cassettes, derailleurs and rings. The power of the motor can easily be expected to trash these components way faster than a human power. > In the extraordinarily unlikely case that somebody manages to wear out the chain on a cheap bike, they're almost certainly as well off just buying a new cheap bike. This is false, because chains cost something like $15-$30. Cheap chains and drive sets are still found on entry-level real bikes that might go for $600-$800 or whatever. You're not going to replace an $800 bike because of the chain. It wouldn't make sense to replace even a $100 bike-shaped-object if all it needs is a $15 chain. There was a time when I rode crap bikes; I still maintained them, and replaced the chain. > I've broken and replaced spokes. It's pretty rare. During my daily cycling era when I didn't have a car for some 8 years, I fixed about 3 broken spokes per year. Almost always on the drive side of the rear wheel. So while rarer than a flat tire, it's not that rare. I had no time for bike shops. They are too far away and have stupid hours like not opening until 10:30 on a weekday, and being closed Sundays. They will keep your bike for at least a day, and charge some ridiculous amount to change a part that costs a dollar. Truing a wheel is not difficult (particularly lateral-only truing), and once you go to disc brakes, perfection is less important. The bike can even be ridden for a few days with a broken spoke: you just have to clip it off, because you don't want a broken spoke flailing around. It's not a great idea to ride a wheel with a broken spoke, but lets you schedule a good time to fix it, if you're busy What I'd pay a shop to do would be axial truing: fixing the eccentricity of the wheel's circle. I asume that if I tell a shop to true a wheel, they are only going to care about left-right wobble, which "anyone" can do.

mrob 4y ago
>I fixed about 3 broken spokes per year. Almost always on the drive side of the rear wheel. This hints at one less obvious advantage of the drive system described in the article: no need for asymmetrical wheel dishing. Rear wheels for conventional derailleur systems have to be built asymmetrically[0]. This makes the wheel weaker than a symmetrical one, because the drive side spokes are under higher tension. I ride a hub gear bicycle with symmetrical wheels as my primary form of transport and I've never broken a spoke. Electric drive would allow the same wheel strength. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bicycle_wheel#Dish https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bicycle_wheel#Dish