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>According to Wikipedia [1] the dish chicken tikka masala is thought to have been invented by Bangladeshi chefs working in the UK in the 1960s. Doesn't that mak

>According to Wikipedia [1] the dish chicken tikka masala is thought to have been invented by Bangladeshi chefs working in the UK in the 1960s. Doesn't that make it at least somewhat British? First of all that is not a well-established origin story, but more like an urban legend. There are multiple conflicting versions of this same urban legend where multiple different restaurants claim to have invented the dish in the same way. And the restaurant chain (Moti Mahal) from one of these versions had been serving a virtually identical dish in their Delhi restaurant since the 1950s, ten years before any of these supposed origin stories. I will let you come to your own conclusions about what scope for authenticity that leaves for these stories. >If I, as a Swedish person, move to the US and compose an awesome recipe for pizzaballs [2] where I combine Swedish meatballs with the American love for all things pizza [3] and it becomes a huge hit which is exported to the rest of the world, would that make the dish Swedish? In your case at least you will be doing some "fusion" or "innovation" right? What exactly is the "fusion" or "innovation" in chicken tikka masala? Can anyone of sound mind actually claim that chicken tikka masala and butter chicken are two completely different dishes? While we are making up examples on the spot, here is a more accurate one. If I start making pizzas in India and because mozzarella is hard to find here, just use processed cheese instead and may be put more chilis on top to suit Indian tastes, does the dish stop being pizza? There has to be some reasonable limitation on how little you modify something before you get to call it a new "invention".

unwind 4y ago
All good points, thanks. I guess food history is murky and complicated, even for semi-modern things like this. :) I don't know remotely enough about Indian food to measure the degree of innovation in tikka masala, I'm afraid.
- alex_smart 4y ago
  Recipe for butter chicken: roasted pieces of tandoori chicken in a tomatoey butter based sauce. Recipe for chicken tikka masala: roasted pieces of tandoori chicken in a tomatoey cream based sauce. As is often the case with cultural appropriation, the real innovation by the appropriator was the marketing. In my view, this is what probably happened: multiple restaurants found the fake origin story a profitable and interesting marketing tool and judging by how popular indian food is in the UK today, it obviously worked.
irishsultan 4y ago
> If I start making pizzas in India and because mozzarella is hard to find here, just use processed cheese instead and may be put more chilis on top to suit Indian tastes, does the dish stop being pizza No, but if you call that pizza something like Pizza Kalari would it then be wrong to say that Pizza Kalari is an Indian invention?
- alex_smart 4y ago
  >No, but if you call that pizza something like Pizza Kalari would it then be wrong to say that Pizza Kalari is an Indian invention? I already answered your question in the next line in my comment -- There has to be some reasonable limitation on how little you modify something before you get to call it a new "invention". Besides, no Indian would feel the need to do that because, unlike the British, we are quite comfortable in our culinary identity. And most Indians would not respond well to such marketing. In fact, things like Pizza and Burger fill pretty much the exact opposite niche in India where eating very crappy versions of these western foods seems to have an aspirational value to it.

unwind 4y ago

All good points, thanks. I guess food history is murky and complicated, even for semi-modern things like this. :) I don't know remotely enough about Indian food to measure the degree of innovation in tikka masala, I'm afraid.

alex_smart 4y ago
Recipe for butter chicken: roasted pieces of tandoori chicken in a tomatoey butter based sauce. Recipe for chicken tikka masala: roasted pieces of tandoori chicken in a tomatoey cream based sauce. As is often the case with cultural appropriation, the real innovation by the appropriator was the marketing. In my view, this is what probably happened: multiple restaurants found the fake origin story a profitable and interesting marketing tool and judging by how popular indian food is in the UK today, it obviously worked.

irishsultan 4y ago

> If I start making pizzas in India and because mozzarella is hard to find here, just use processed cheese instead and may be put more chilis on top to suit Indian tastes, does the dish stop being pizza No, but if you call that pizza something like Pizza Kalari would it then be wrong to say that Pizza Kalari is an Indian invention?

alex_smart 4y ago
>No, but if you call that pizza something like Pizza Kalari would it then be wrong to say that Pizza Kalari is an Indian invention? I already answered your question in the next line in my comment -- There has to be some reasonable limitation on how little you modify something before you get to call it a new "invention". Besides, no Indian would feel the need to do that because, unlike the British, we are quite comfortable in our culinary identity. And most Indians would not respond well to such marketing. In fact, things like Pizza and Burger fill pretty much the exact opposite niche in India where eating very crappy versions of these western foods seems to have an aspirational value to it.