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> I think its because they are used to shitty dough. Whaaaaat? The best and only original Pizza is the thin stone oven baked one, please visit Naples to experi

> I think its because they are used to shitty dough. Whaaaaat? The best and only original Pizza is the thin stone oven baked one, please visit Naples to experience it. The thick fake ones you can also call pizza because they are round, but it is just stuff on shitty sugar white bread, ludicrous to me you just don't eat a toast or a baguette then

graftak 4y ago
> sugar white bread You mean cake?
- dTal 4y ago
  Cake has eggs.
  - ExtraE 4y ago
    So do enriched breads like brioche.
mlindner 4y ago
- theodric 4y ago
  Winner for most American comment in the thread. There are more people in the EU than the USA, and I think you'd struggle to find many who prefer Chicago Deep Dish to a nice flat Italian. But I wouldn't be surprised if one of them replied to me telling me how wrong I am.
  - mjevans 4y ago
    CDD isn't Pizza but a pizza inspired casserole. 'Detroit style' ... shudder technically still pizza, but I don't get the cotton candy like dough or the typical choice of spices. New York style is fine. California tends to have weird toppings but is also OK. Though IMO pizza requires a 'bread', tomato (usually as a sauce), and cheese, in a 'flat bread' style format. Thick or thin can all be good, and every type is going to have it's fan, even if that person happens to hate some component or another. Even if it's Pizza Inspired, it can be tasty.
    - bee_rider 4y ago
      I think the tomato is not totally necessary. You can get a pizza with a white sauce (Bechamel?), ricotta, and garlic at some of the places around here. I don't think it is a weird American chain thing, if I remember the story correctly my mom first encountered it overseas...
      - HNDen21 4y ago
        Right, you can get the 4 cheese pizza(quattro formaggi) Has no tomato and is delicious... I have seen mushroom pizza without tomato as well
      - themaninthedark 4y ago
        You can also get pesto sauces
      - gpderetta 4y ago
        "Pizza Bianca" is very common kind of pizza in Italy: no tomato, with mozzarella, sometimes ricotta; commonly offered with a variety of toppings, often prosciutto.
  - 2muchcoffeeman 4y ago
    New York is full of the more traditional base but different toppings. Lots of places in Australia are also doing the same. But grand parent is right. The popular vision of pizza is what Italian immigrants exported from the US not what was exported from Italy. And if you want to play the numbers game, go to Asia and ask them what a pizza is. I’m not sure many people prefer the Chicago deep dish style or “Sicilian pizza”. I’ve not tried either. But dominos and Pizza Hut seem to be some in between thing. Edit: Rereading mlidners comment and other comments, it's a bit too dismissive of Italian pizza. Italian pizza is still pizza. It's just that American pizza is also pizza. And Swedish pizza is pizza. This is what happens when food is popularised and spread across the world.
  - mlindner 4y ago
    There are more American types of pizza than Chicago Deep Dish (though I do love that as well). And yes the most common type of Pizza in Europe is also based on the American invented version, not the Italian one. It was reverse imported back into Europe from America.
    - tigershark 4y ago
      Stop spreading bullshit, please.
    - croon 4y ago
      As someone who has been looking all over Sweden for American pizza (specifically NY style for sake of variation) closer than the few Dominos franchises which exist, I'm rejecting that claim. Neapolitan pizza is great, American pizza is great, Swedish pizza (both kebab and otherwise) is great, it's just that if you're going to claim something is "more" pizza than something else, I'm going to give it to Italy.
- alex_smart 4y ago
  This comment is hilarious to me because this is the first example i have seen of white people getting their culture appropriated. I suppose an Italian reading this might feel the same way I felt when I learnt that the British claim chicken tikka masala as their own.
  - eru 4y ago
    > This comment is hilarious to me because this is the first example i have seen of white people getting their culture appropriated. Happens all the time. Ever heard of Hamburgers?
    - fartcannon 4y ago
      Also which white people? Do the Greeks or Romans count? Because if they do... The movie industry in the united states is a culture exporter. Probably uncountable examples from just that alone. Surely some of that is both OP's definition of 'White' and appropriated outside its original countries.
  - mlindner 4y ago
    I mean it's really not cultural appropriation. Pizza is one of the great American inventions. It was brought over by Italian immigrants and evolved into a main stream staple served the world over, and that's based on the American Pizza, not the Italian one. Hot dogs are similar in that way.
    - dcx 4y ago
      Sorry, but this is absolutely false. The US was not the only country to receive immigrants during the two Italian diasporas [1], and so you are not the only country to develop a taste for Italian cuisine. Australian pizza descends directly from the Italian style. We do have the American style as well, but it's a minority preference. Our pizza usually looks like this [2]. It's also notable that Starbucks failed to make a dent here [3], because our coffee culture is truer to its Italian roots than yours. Given the circumstances in which this happened here, it stretches credulity to imagine that the preferences for pizza across Western Europe, South America, and Africa have been filtered through American preferences when Italians have been there making pizza for just as long. Please check your exceptionalism, thanks. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italian_diaspora#Statistics https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italian_diaspora#Statistics [2] https://www.idealista.it/en/news/lifestyle-italy/2019/06/10/2491-most-popular-authentic-italian-pizzas https://www.idealista.it/en/news/lifestyle-italy/2019/06/10/... [2] https://www.cnbc.com/2018/07/20/starbucks-australia-coffee-failure.html https://www.cnbc.com/2018/07/20/starbucks-australia-coffee-f...
- shaky-carrousel 4y ago
  > Pizza is an American invention (at least as we eat it now). "We" meaning Americans, which are a minuscule part of world population, and a less minuscule but still small amount of world pizza eaters. It's like Venezuelans claiming baseball is a Venezuelan sport. > Italian pizza is a completely different thing and America has spent a lot more time refining the idea of a pizza in the first place so American pizza is more advanced. I see you got confused and used the wrong words. Instead of "refining" you probably should use "defiling", and instead of "advanced" you probably should use "degraded". > So those flat pizzas aren't really what pizza is anymore. I'm afraid the land of deep fried, sugar imbued everything is not in any position to claim what pizza is or is not. This is probably the most blatant case of appropriation I've seen ever. You have every right to take a pizza and pervert it as your pleasure, but to claim that now you make the true pizza is so smug, and so ignorant that it baffles me. As I said in other comment, I don't know why, but it is a typical American trait for some reason, being smugly ignorant. Ignorants are everywhere, but that cultural thing, "we are the best country in the world, the chosen people" that seeps through American culture, makes American ignorants specially smug.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - taylodl 4y ago
    Perhaps you're not aware that the number of Italian-Americans is almost half of the population of Italy. My two favorite pizza shops in my town? They're both owned and run by Italian families. This is the norm, not the exception. They even grow their own tomatoes! This isn't always the case for the national pizza chains, but you'll be hard-pressed to find an American claiming these chains are their favorite pizza (sadly, they do exist - but they're not the majority!) It was Italian Americans who developed the New York Slice. It was Sicilians who developed the Chicago Deep Dish. You call it cultural appropriation. I call it immigrants bringing their food with them and further developing it. Does that make pizza American? Well, I've noticed most of what the english-speaking world calls "pizza" is actually a pizza of Italian-American origin, not the Neapolitan pizza hailing from Naples. I think this is what the OP was referring to.
- tigershark 4y ago
  No, it’s not. Stop spreading disinformation. “ Pizza (Italian: [ˈpittsa], Neapolitan: [ˈpittsə]) is a dish of Italian origin” https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pizza https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pizza The only thing that the Americans invented is that cardboard stuff full of toppings that you outrageously call pizza, because you were not able to cook a proper pizza.
  - account42 4y ago
    Show us on the doll where the american pizza hurt you.
    - gpderetta 4y ago
      Tastebuds probably? Kidding aside that Chicago-style deep pizza looks delicious, but I wouldn't call it pizza.
- gpderetta 4y ago
  I feel we already had this argument before, but the modern Pizza Margherita [1] was already "codified" well before the first Italian diaspora. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pizza_Margherita https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pizza_Margherita
- Fnoord 4y ago
  I have been to both USA and Italy and ate the specific style of pizza in each country. I regard American pizza as a regression. When someone says pizza I assume Italian style. They can shove the American style in a place where the sun does not shine (oven!) as in I ain't paying for it. I will pay a good amount for an Italian style pizza though.
- FabHK 4y ago
  I'd certainly concur that American Pizza seems to have more variety.
fartcannon 4y ago
I have! It's fine. Could be better.
dredmorbius 4y ago
True traditionalists insist on rosewater and sugar. https://yewtu.be/watch?v=h6XvMKdD2tY https://yewtu.be/watch?v=h6XvMKdD2tY

graftak 4y ago

> sugar white bread You mean cake?

dTal 4y ago
Cake has eggs.
- ExtraE 4y ago
  So do enriched breads like brioche.

mlindner 4y ago

theodric 4y ago
Winner for most American comment in the thread. There are more people in the EU than the USA, and I think you'd struggle to find many who prefer Chicago Deep Dish to a nice flat Italian. But I wouldn't be surprised if one of them replied to me telling me how wrong I am.
- mjevans 4y ago
  CDD isn't Pizza but a pizza inspired casserole. 'Detroit style' ... shudder technically still pizza, but I don't get the cotton candy like dough or the typical choice of spices. New York style is fine. California tends to have weird toppings but is also OK. Though IMO pizza requires a 'bread', tomato (usually as a sauce), and cheese, in a 'flat bread' style format. Thick or thin can all be good, and every type is going to have it's fan, even if that person happens to hate some component or another. Even if it's Pizza Inspired, it can be tasty.
  - bee_rider 4y ago
    I think the tomato is not totally necessary. You can get a pizza with a white sauce (Bechamel?), ricotta, and garlic at some of the places around here. I don't think it is a weird American chain thing, if I remember the story correctly my mom first encountered it overseas...
    - HNDen21 4y ago
      Right, you can get the 4 cheese pizza(quattro formaggi) Has no tomato and is delicious... I have seen mushroom pizza without tomato as well
    - themaninthedark 4y ago
      You can also get pesto sauces
    - gpderetta 4y ago
      "Pizza Bianca" is very common kind of pizza in Italy: no tomato, with mozzarella, sometimes ricotta; commonly offered with a variety of toppings, often prosciutto.
- 2muchcoffeeman 4y ago
  New York is full of the more traditional base but different toppings. Lots of places in Australia are also doing the same. But grand parent is right. The popular vision of pizza is what Italian immigrants exported from the US not what was exported from Italy. And if you want to play the numbers game, go to Asia and ask them what a pizza is. I’m not sure many people prefer the Chicago deep dish style or “Sicilian pizza”. I’ve not tried either. But dominos and Pizza Hut seem to be some in between thing. Edit: Rereading mlidners comment and other comments, it's a bit too dismissive of Italian pizza. Italian pizza is still pizza. It's just that American pizza is also pizza. And Swedish pizza is pizza. This is what happens when food is popularised and spread across the world.
- mlindner 4y ago
  There are more American types of pizza than Chicago Deep Dish (though I do love that as well). And yes the most common type of Pizza in Europe is also based on the American invented version, not the Italian one. It was reverse imported back into Europe from America.
  - tigershark 4y ago
    Stop spreading bullshit, please.
  - croon 4y ago
    As someone who has been looking all over Sweden for American pizza (specifically NY style for sake of variation) closer than the few Dominos franchises which exist, I'm rejecting that claim. Neapolitan pizza is great, American pizza is great, Swedish pizza (both kebab and otherwise) is great, it's just that if you're going to claim something is "more" pizza than something else, I'm going to give it to Italy.
alex_smart 4y ago
This comment is hilarious to me because this is the first example i have seen of white people getting their culture appropriated. I suppose an Italian reading this might feel the same way I felt when I learnt that the British claim chicken tikka masala as their own.
- eru 4y ago
  > This comment is hilarious to me because this is the first example i have seen of white people getting their culture appropriated. Happens all the time. Ever heard of Hamburgers?
  - fartcannon 4y ago
    Also which white people? Do the Greeks or Romans count? Because if they do... The movie industry in the united states is a culture exporter. Probably uncountable examples from just that alone. Surely some of that is both OP's definition of 'White' and appropriated outside its original countries.
- mlindner 4y ago
  I mean it's really not cultural appropriation. Pizza is one of the great American inventions. It was brought over by Italian immigrants and evolved into a main stream staple served the world over, and that's based on the American Pizza, not the Italian one. Hot dogs are similar in that way.
  - dcx 4y ago
    Sorry, but this is absolutely false. The US was not the only country to receive immigrants during the two Italian diasporas [1], and so you are not the only country to develop a taste for Italian cuisine. Australian pizza descends directly from the Italian style. We do have the American style as well, but it's a minority preference. Our pizza usually looks like this [2]. It's also notable that Starbucks failed to make a dent here [3], because our coffee culture is truer to its Italian roots than yours. Given the circumstances in which this happened here, it stretches credulity to imagine that the preferences for pizza across Western Europe, South America, and Africa have been filtered through American preferences when Italians have been there making pizza for just as long. Please check your exceptionalism, thanks. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italian_diaspora#Statistics https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italian_diaspora#Statistics [2] https://www.idealista.it/en/news/lifestyle-italy/2019/06/10/2491-most-popular-authentic-italian-pizzas https://www.idealista.it/en/news/lifestyle-italy/2019/06/10/... [2] https://www.cnbc.com/2018/07/20/starbucks-australia-coffee-failure.html https://www.cnbc.com/2018/07/20/starbucks-australia-coffee-f...
shaky-carrousel 4y ago
> Pizza is an American invention (at least as we eat it now). "We" meaning Americans, which are a minuscule part of world population, and a less minuscule but still small amount of world pizza eaters. It's like Venezuelans claiming baseball is a Venezuelan sport. > Italian pizza is a completely different thing and America has spent a lot more time refining the idea of a pizza in the first place so American pizza is more advanced. I see you got confused and used the wrong words. Instead of "refining" you probably should use "defiling", and instead of "advanced" you probably should use "degraded". > So those flat pizzas aren't really what pizza is anymore. I'm afraid the land of deep fried, sugar imbued everything is not in any position to claim what pizza is or is not. This is probably the most blatant case of appropriation I've seen ever. You have every right to take a pizza and pervert it as your pleasure, but to claim that now you make the true pizza is so smug, and so ignorant that it baffles me. As I said in other comment, I don't know why, but it is a typical American trait for some reason, being smugly ignorant. Ignorants are everywhere, but that cultural thing, "we are the best country in the world, the chosen people" that seeps through American culture, makes American ignorants specially smug.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- taylodl 4y ago
  Perhaps you're not aware that the number of Italian-Americans is almost half of the population of Italy. My two favorite pizza shops in my town? They're both owned and run by Italian families. This is the norm, not the exception. They even grow their own tomatoes! This isn't always the case for the national pizza chains, but you'll be hard-pressed to find an American claiming these chains are their favorite pizza (sadly, they do exist - but they're not the majority!) It was Italian Americans who developed the New York Slice. It was Sicilians who developed the Chicago Deep Dish. You call it cultural appropriation. I call it immigrants bringing their food with them and further developing it. Does that make pizza American? Well, I've noticed most of what the english-speaking world calls "pizza" is actually a pizza of Italian-American origin, not the Neapolitan pizza hailing from Naples. I think this is what the OP was referring to.
tigershark 4y ago
No, it’s not. Stop spreading disinformation. “ Pizza (Italian: [ˈpittsa], Neapolitan: [ˈpittsə]) is a dish of Italian origin” https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pizza https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pizza The only thing that the Americans invented is that cardboard stuff full of toppings that you outrageously call pizza, because you were not able to cook a proper pizza.
- account42 4y ago
  Show us on the doll where the american pizza hurt you.
  - gpderetta 4y ago
    Tastebuds probably? Kidding aside that Chicago-style deep pizza looks delicious, but I wouldn't call it pizza.
gpderetta 4y ago
I feel we already had this argument before, but the modern Pizza Margherita [1] was already "codified" well before the first Italian diaspora. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pizza_Margherita https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pizza_Margherita
Fnoord 4y ago
I have been to both USA and Italy and ate the specific style of pizza in each country. I regard American pizza as a regression. When someone says pizza I assume Italian style. They can shove the American style in a place where the sun does not shine (oven!) as in I ain't paying for it. I will pay a good amount for an Italian style pizza though.
FabHK 4y ago
I'd certainly concur that American Pizza seems to have more variety.

fartcannon 4y ago

I have! It's fine. Could be better.

dredmorbius 4y ago

True traditionalists insist on rosewater and sugar. https://yewtu.be/watch?v=h6XvMKdD2tY https://yewtu.be/watch?v=h6XvMKdD2tY