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> that you want cities that make middle class white folks feel safe I don't see where they say this. > "there are too many poor brown folks in the city" This

> that you want cities that make middle class white folks feel safe I don't see where they say this. > "there are too many poor brown folks in the city" This comes off as projection. > What specifically do you think needs to change for that to be true? They listed several things.

slg 4y ago
>I don't see where they say this. I literally quoted them saying this. Here it is again "just make the city centres safe, clean, friendly places so that people who are "middle class, suburban, and white" want to live there". >This comes off as projection. I don't understand what you think I am projecting. I'm afraid of poor brown people? I don't want white people in the city? For the record, I am a white person who has lived in the middle of various major American cities most of my life. I'm not going to argue with you if you cite housing costs, having a yard, privacy, calmness, or any of the numerous other advantages suburban life has over city living. But when I see someone complain that cities aren't "safe, clean, [or] friendly" for middle class white folks, I will call out what I see as a recycled dog whistle from the 1950s and 1960s. >They listed several things. I questioned those listed things because the implication behind them is not true. White people aren't waiting for cities to become safe because the cities have already gotten safe.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- kcplate 4y ago
  > I literally quoted them saying this. Here it is again "just make the city centres safe, clean, friendly places so that people who are "middle class, suburban, and white" want to live there". That commenter was actually quoting part of the comment above him… > The communities that hand-wring the most about predators and risks to children tend to be middle class, suburban, and white
- zdragnar 4y ago
  That quote is literally a quote of the parent post- I read it as sarcasm, rather than a genuine belief (that this thread appears to be reading as literal and hence, projecting). The fact is, this person was clearly also the victim of violence and chose to move out because they, specifically, were not safe. There's nothing dog-whistle about it. The nearest metro to me just had a city council meeting to discuss snow plow drivers complaining about being shot at while on the job, and their struggles in hiring other city workers who are being harassed. Their response was to recommend trauma counselling to those who were shot at. Many people who are comfortable not living in a city (even if they would prefer it) move out when they realize they have to raise their kids there. If inner cities were as safe, clean and friendly as my rural community, I too might never have moved out. Instead, I realized that only one of my neighbors ever showed the slightest interest in talking to me, were frequently rude, and few people walked anywhere alone. In the years I've left, carjackings, theft and vandalism have gotten so much worse- to the point that in some formerly "safe" neighborhoods, you couldn't lock your car door when parking on the street because if thieves couldn't open the handle, they'd just smash a window to get in. Life isn't perfect out in the country, but there is literally nothing about living in a big city that is attractive enough to make me want to go back to that. Cry "dogwhistle" all you want, but skin color has nothing to do with this story.
  - slg 4y ago
    > Cry "dogwhistle" all you want, but skin color has nothing to do with this story Then don’t mention the skin color in the first place. I wouldn’t have replied if the two comments above me didn’t paint this as a racial issue by specifically mentioning this was an issue for middle class white people and not just middle class people.

slg 4y ago

>I don't see where they say this. I literally quoted them saying this. Here it is again "just make the city centres safe, clean, friendly places so that people who are "middle class, suburban, and white" want to live there". >This comes off as projection. I don't understand what you think I am projecting. I'm afraid of poor brown people? I don't want white people in the city? For the record, I am a white person who has lived in the middle of various major American cities most of my life. I'm not going to argue with you if you cite housing costs, having a yard, privacy, calmness, or any of the numerous other advantages suburban life has over city living. But when I see someone complain that cities aren't "safe, clean, [or] friendly" for middle class white folks, I will call out what I see as a recycled dog whistle from the 1950s and 1960s. >They listed several things. I questioned those listed things because the implication behind them is not true. White people aren't waiting for cities to become safe because the cities have already gotten safe.

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
kcplate 4y ago
> I literally quoted them saying this. Here it is again "just make the city centres safe, clean, friendly places so that people who are "middle class, suburban, and white" want to live there". That commenter was actually quoting part of the comment above him… > The communities that hand-wring the most about predators and risks to children tend to be middle class, suburban, and white
zdragnar 4y ago
That quote is literally a quote of the parent post- I read it as sarcasm, rather than a genuine belief (that this thread appears to be reading as literal and hence, projecting). The fact is, this person was clearly also the victim of violence and chose to move out because they, specifically, were not safe. There's nothing dog-whistle about it. The nearest metro to me just had a city council meeting to discuss snow plow drivers complaining about being shot at while on the job, and their struggles in hiring other city workers who are being harassed. Their response was to recommend trauma counselling to those who were shot at. Many people who are comfortable not living in a city (even if they would prefer it) move out when they realize they have to raise their kids there. If inner cities were as safe, clean and friendly as my rural community, I too might never have moved out. Instead, I realized that only one of my neighbors ever showed the slightest interest in talking to me, were frequently rude, and few people walked anywhere alone. In the years I've left, carjackings, theft and vandalism have gotten so much worse- to the point that in some formerly "safe" neighborhoods, you couldn't lock your car door when parking on the street because if thieves couldn't open the handle, they'd just smash a window to get in. Life isn't perfect out in the country, but there is literally nothing about living in a big city that is attractive enough to make me want to go back to that. Cry "dogwhistle" all you want, but skin color has nothing to do with this story.
- slg 4y ago
  > Cry "dogwhistle" all you want, but skin color has nothing to do with this story Then don’t mention the skin color in the first place. I wouldn’t have replied if the two comments above me didn’t paint this as a racial issue by specifically mentioning this was an issue for middle class white people and not just middle class people.