4 ms·

To remain in the ERM the UK had to raise interest rates to alarming levels causing a deep and unnecessary recession. A lot of negative equity for home owners, u

To remain in the ERM the UK had to raise interest rates to alarming levels causing a deep and unnecessary recession. A lot of negative equity for home owners, unemployment rising back to 3 million. It's was unsustainable. Soros and the other speculators did us a favour ejecting us from it. The UK had about 15 years of low inflation growth after we that so Soros deserved a medal.

blibble 4y ago
the irony is by breaking the UK out of the ERM: Soros enabled brexit if the UK had stayed in the ERM it would have joined the euro and exiting would have been impossible Soros is very, very much against brexit, to such an extent he funded numerous remain campaigns and continued to fund campaigns dedicated to overturning the result (Trump style)
- greggsy 4y ago
  Interesting - I’m a bit of an outsider, but Soros always came up in Q conspiracy theories
  - jstream67 4y ago
    I'm not sure about 'Q', but he comes up a lot because he is where the 'far left' side of the democrats get most of their funding. He dumps large sums of money into local elections across the US to elect officials who will be soft on crime. edit - this is why left wing groups try to shut down all discussion of him by screaming antisemitism, and why right wing groups are convinced he is the root of all evil.
    - ipython 4y ago
      Soft on crime? Citation needed
      - jstream67 4y ago
        https://nypost.com/2021/12/16/how-george-soros-funded-progressive-das-behind-us-crime-surge/ https://nypost.com/2021/12/16/how-george-soros-funded-progre... Oh come on :) You can't tell me you haven't heard of this?
    - t_scytale 4y ago
      > soft on crime I think he funds some groups that advocate criminal justice reform. There is a case to be made that the sky-high incarceration rates are indicative of a wider problem.
- drumhead 4y ago
  The ejection from the ERM was probably the point at which the Brexit movement became more serious.
- swarnie 4y ago
  > the irony is by breaking the UK out of the ERM: Soros enabled brexit So... Two medals?
- ben_w 4y ago
  > exiting would have been impossible Actually impossible, or just really bad for everyone’s economies? Because every time I saw the suggestion that Brexit would be bad for the British economy (or indeed anything British), I saw someone dismiss the suggestion as “project fear”, while any suggestion it might be in any way bad for anyone else was met with the response that this was a reason the UK “would get a good deal”. Sometimes I even witnessed both of these responses from the same person in successive sentences in contexts where it would be illogical for both to be true.
  - blibble 4y ago
    > Sometimes I even witnessed both of these responses from the same person in successive sentences in contexts where it would be illogical for both to be true. to be blunt: this is your misunderstanding fundamentally leaving the currency/monetary union and leaving the economic/political union are completely different things, so obviously they would have different outcomes Greece was considering the former, the UK carried out the latter the latter (brexit) is at worst is predicted to do some minor damage to growth over a long period of time, which your average person won't even notice ignoring the practical problems of re-introducing a currency (eg. prevent people hoarding physical euros), even the suggestion that leaving the euro is going to happen would immediately trigger a massive exodus of capital, and at the point it happens you have a massive devaluation that immediately wipes out the savings accounts of everyone in the country as the speculators pile in and then inflation goes crazy (making today look harmless) as the Greeks discovered: it is politically impossible, especially when the EU's position is that "the Euro and the EU are linked: leaving one means leaving the other", which would have triggered the situation above in a UK with that adopted the euro
    - ben_w 4y ago
      > to be blunt: this is your misunderstanding Ironically, you seem to have misunderstood me, because: > fundamentally leaving the currency/monetary union and leaving the economic/political union are completely different things, so obviously they would have different outcomes Is something I’m aware of and I wasn’t contradicting. I was saying potential negative consequences specifically of Brexit were near-simultaneously used by the same person both were not going to happen at all and yet simultaneously that they were a reason the EU would give the UK a good deal. In one case, the pause between these two claims being made by the same person was literally only just long enough for me to say “no” without actually justifying why I was disagreeing with him. So please, don’t just say I’m misunderstanding. And that makes me think that in a parallel world where the UK has been in the Euro but still voted to leave the EU, the government may well have dismissed any and all concerns about the economic consequences, left, and then blamed all the harm that did happen on “remoaners” and “saboteurs” and “the jealous EU”, just like they did for the much milder difficulties they faced in the real world. > it is politically impossible, especially when the EU's position is that "the Euro and the EU are linked: leaving one means leaving the other" First, “Politically impossible” doesn’t seem to be in the vocabulary of current UK politicians right now. Second, I get the impression many of the louder Leave campaigners hated both the currency and the EU, so I don’t actually see how your claims are evidence makes it more politically channeling in the UK than Brexit was all by itself. Economically more challenging, sure (though you’ve still not convinced me it would have been impossible). Politically more challenging? I don’t see it.
- anonymous_sorry 4y ago
  Not "Trump style". I have not heard any claim (Soros-associated or otherwise) that the Brexit referendum was "stolen". Plenty of accusations of dishonesty and dodgy campaign finance on the Leave side, but the vote tally isn't really contested.
  - blibble 4y ago
    there were several very well funded attempts in overturning the result using the legal system, in the same way Trump did and using the media in exactly the same way Trump did the phrases were different ("Russian interference", "non-binding referendum", "people didn't understand what they were voting for"), but the intended outcome was the same: overturning a legitimate result conducted fairly and this went on for years the only difference is the people trying to overturn the referendum result were considered "the good guys", so it's acceptable whereas for Trump, it's unacceptable because he's the bad guy
    - t_scytale 4y ago
      > and was exactly the same as what Trump was doing It really wasn't. Trump is claiming widespread electoral fraud. Big difference.
      - blibble 4y ago
        there were several well publicised lawsuits claiming fraud
    - anonymous_sorry 4y ago
      > not to mention using the media in exactly the same way Trump did All political campaigns try to get their message across through a variety of media. Can you be specific? The remainer objections you quote are at least arguable (some more so than others). Many remainers wanted the result overturned through legal or political mechanisms (typically, a second referendum). But Trump pressured officials to modify vote tallies and literally told followers the election was "stolen". There is a distinction.

blibble 4y ago

the irony is by breaking the UK out of the ERM: Soros enabled brexit if the UK had stayed in the ERM it would have joined the euro and exiting would have been impossible Soros is very, very much against brexit, to such an extent he funded numerous remain campaigns and continued to fund campaigns dedicated to overturning the result (Trump style)

greggsy 4y ago
Interesting - I’m a bit of an outsider, but Soros always came up in Q conspiracy theories
- jstream67 4y ago
  I'm not sure about 'Q', but he comes up a lot because he is where the 'far left' side of the democrats get most of their funding. He dumps large sums of money into local elections across the US to elect officials who will be soft on crime. edit - this is why left wing groups try to shut down all discussion of him by screaming antisemitism, and why right wing groups are convinced he is the root of all evil.
  - ipython 4y ago
    Soft on crime? Citation needed
    - jstream67 4y ago
      https://nypost.com/2021/12/16/how-george-soros-funded-progressive-das-behind-us-crime-surge/ https://nypost.com/2021/12/16/how-george-soros-funded-progre... Oh come on :) You can't tell me you haven't heard of this?
  - t_scytale 4y ago
    > soft on crime I think he funds some groups that advocate criminal justice reform. There is a case to be made that the sky-high incarceration rates are indicative of a wider problem.
drumhead 4y ago
The ejection from the ERM was probably the point at which the Brexit movement became more serious.
swarnie 4y ago
> the irony is by breaking the UK out of the ERM: Soros enabled brexit So... Two medals?
ben_w 4y ago
> exiting would have been impossible Actually impossible, or just really bad for everyone’s economies? Because every time I saw the suggestion that Brexit would be bad for the British economy (or indeed anything British), I saw someone dismiss the suggestion as “project fear”, while any suggestion it might be in any way bad for anyone else was met with the response that this was a reason the UK “would get a good deal”. Sometimes I even witnessed both of these responses from the same person in successive sentences in contexts where it would be illogical for both to be true.
- blibble 4y ago
  > Sometimes I even witnessed both of these responses from the same person in successive sentences in contexts where it would be illogical for both to be true. to be blunt: this is your misunderstanding fundamentally leaving the currency/monetary union and leaving the economic/political union are completely different things, so obviously they would have different outcomes Greece was considering the former, the UK carried out the latter the latter (brexit) is at worst is predicted to do some minor damage to growth over a long period of time, which your average person won't even notice ignoring the practical problems of re-introducing a currency (eg. prevent people hoarding physical euros), even the suggestion that leaving the euro is going to happen would immediately trigger a massive exodus of capital, and at the point it happens you have a massive devaluation that immediately wipes out the savings accounts of everyone in the country as the speculators pile in and then inflation goes crazy (making today look harmless) as the Greeks discovered: it is politically impossible, especially when the EU's position is that "the Euro and the EU are linked: leaving one means leaving the other", which would have triggered the situation above in a UK with that adopted the euro
  - ben_w 4y ago
    > to be blunt: this is your misunderstanding Ironically, you seem to have misunderstood me, because: > fundamentally leaving the currency/monetary union and leaving the economic/political union are completely different things, so obviously they would have different outcomes Is something I’m aware of and I wasn’t contradicting. I was saying potential negative consequences specifically of Brexit were near-simultaneously used by the same person both were not going to happen at all and yet simultaneously that they were a reason the EU would give the UK a good deal. In one case, the pause between these two claims being made by the same person was literally only just long enough for me to say “no” without actually justifying why I was disagreeing with him. So please, don’t just say I’m misunderstanding. And that makes me think that in a parallel world where the UK has been in the Euro but still voted to leave the EU, the government may well have dismissed any and all concerns about the economic consequences, left, and then blamed all the harm that did happen on “remoaners” and “saboteurs” and “the jealous EU”, just like they did for the much milder difficulties they faced in the real world. > it is politically impossible, especially when the EU's position is that "the Euro and the EU are linked: leaving one means leaving the other" First, “Politically impossible” doesn’t seem to be in the vocabulary of current UK politicians right now. Second, I get the impression many of the louder Leave campaigners hated both the currency and the EU, so I don’t actually see how your claims are evidence makes it more politically channeling in the UK than Brexit was all by itself. Economically more challenging, sure (though you’ve still not convinced me it would have been impossible). Politically more challenging? I don’t see it.
anonymous_sorry 4y ago
Not "Trump style". I have not heard any claim (Soros-associated or otherwise) that the Brexit referendum was "stolen". Plenty of accusations of dishonesty and dodgy campaign finance on the Leave side, but the vote tally isn't really contested.
- blibble 4y ago
  there were several very well funded attempts in overturning the result using the legal system, in the same way Trump did and using the media in exactly the same way Trump did the phrases were different ("Russian interference", "non-binding referendum", "people didn't understand what they were voting for"), but the intended outcome was the same: overturning a legitimate result conducted fairly and this went on for years the only difference is the people trying to overturn the referendum result were considered "the good guys", so it's acceptable whereas for Trump, it's unacceptable because he's the bad guy
  - t_scytale 4y ago
    > and was exactly the same as what Trump was doing It really wasn't. Trump is claiming widespread electoral fraud. Big difference.
    - blibble 4y ago
      there were several well publicised lawsuits claiming fraud
  - anonymous_sorry 4y ago
    > not to mention using the media in exactly the same way Trump did All political campaigns try to get their message across through a variety of media. Can you be specific? The remainer objections you quote are at least arguable (some more so than others). Many remainers wanted the result overturned through legal or political mechanisms (typically, a second referendum). But Trump pressured officials to modify vote tallies and literally told followers the election was "stolen". There is a distinction.