7 ms·

I'm not entirely sure what you're referring to - can you elaborate? How have the EU gone with UK and US interests rather than their own?

by bpye 4y ago

kkfx 4y ago
Russian Fed. is a natural partner: - we are all European, till the Urals, we understand each others as we have done even during the cold war BETTER that what we do with the so called "anglosphere" (cfr Limes, geopolitical review), we also share similar values; - they have gazillion of natural resources we need, they are developed enough to harvest them but not enough to surpass us in tech terms, they are surrounded by not-really-friendly powers (China in primis) so we need their resources, they need our tech and support, an equal, balanced and fair partnership; Our best interest is going out of NATO, form a REAL European Union, with a common fiscal and social system, a French-lead initial nuclear deterrent toward an EU army (due to the still present language differences that makes a real general army not really doable in short time), toward again an anti-fascist Costitution modeled around Italy and Germany ones, offering Russia to apply for EAEU (EuroAsian union) with a pact of mutual and fair partnership. That's was ALREADY ongoing and that's why USA and UK have crafted Ukrainian coup n. 1 (orange revolution https://doi.org/10.1111/j.1467-856x.2008.00343.x https://doi.org/10.1111/j.1467-856x.2008.00343.x for instance) the n. 2 (Euromaidan massacres [1]) and have keeping forging nazis in the east, if you do not know just read OFFICIAL docs like: https://www.osce.org/files/f/documents/e/7/233896.pdf https://www.osce.org/files/f/documents/e/7/233896.pdf or famous think tanks from USA like: https://www.rand.org/pubs/research_briefs/RB10014.html https://www.rand.org/pubs/research_briefs/RB10014.html and relevant doc https://www.rand.org/content/dam/rand/pubs/research_briefs/RB10000/RB10014/RAND_RB10014.pdf https://www.rand.org/content/dam/rand/pubs/research_briefs/R... [1] start from https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-26079957 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-26079957 and https://jacobinmag.com/2022/02/maidan-protests-neo-nazis-russia-nato-crimea https://jacobinmag.com/2022/02/maidan-protests-neo-nazis-rus... observing the famous "F*ck the EU" Nuland's phrase AND who report that
- postingawayonhn 4y ago
  What a load of rubbish. Russia has no respect for basic human rights and democracy. Deep economic/social integration with Russia is very dangerous for western liberal democracies until Russia makes major reforms (would probably take 50+ years).
  - nixarn 4y ago
    Totally agree. Russia could become a good partner if they'd have a working democracy, freedom of press, freedom of speech. And that the wealth in russia isn't divided so that 500 ppl own 98%+.
  - c0nducktr 4y ago
    > Russia has no respect for basic human rights and democracy. Deep economic/social integration with Russia is very dangerous for western liberal democracies until Russia makes major reforms Is it? We have deep ties with Saudi Arabia. Should those be severed too?
    - throwaway5371 4y ago
      yes
      - c0nducktr 4y ago
        I appriciate your answer, but I was really looking for a response from postingawayonhn.
    - postingawayonhn 4y ago
      Absolutely. The west is only friendly with them to keep oil prices stable and to stop another middle eastern war.
  - kkfx 4y ago
    [flagged]
    - 4y ago
- Isinlor 4y ago
  As a Pole I really do not want to relay on EU members only in helping us defend against Russians. USA and UK have proven to be a lot better partners for Ukraine than France or Germany. 5000 helmets from Germany with a month of delay were really more of an insult than help to Ukraine. France is still going around with "do not humiliate Putin". Well, I want to see him on a trial in Hague. And the idea that Poland will grant Putin any say over our politics is ridiculous.
  - stackbutterflow 4y ago
    The US obviously but what did the UK did better than France and Germany? The UK really is benefiting from sharing the language of the US.
    - Isinlor 4y ago
      UK trained 22 000 Ukrainian army personnel starting from 2015. If I recall correctly they also delivered 2000 NLAWs before the start of the war. Ukrainian soldiers love NLAWs.
  - sam_lowry_ 4y ago
    Germany actually supplies a lot of arms, compared to partners, they announced yesterday that they train Ukrainians to use modern howitzers before sending them to Ukraine. OTOH, their PR is shit.
    - Isinlor 4y ago
      Germans were hoping that Ukraine will fall and they can go on doing business with Russia. Right after 2014 annexation of Crimea they decided to build Nord Stream 2. And they were laughing when USA, Poland, Baltics and Ukraine were telling them that they need to diversify. It's quite possible that without German appeasement of Putin this 2022 invasion would have not even happen. France and Germany blocked Ukraine NATO membership. Some of German leaders still hope to go to business like usual like Volkswagen CEO. Germans still keep on saying that nobody could have foreseen this war. Well, in 2008, 14 years ago, Polish president in Tbilisi during the Russian invasion of Georgia: > We know very well. Today Georgia, tomorrow Ukraine, the day after tomorrow – the Baltic States and later, perhaps, time will come for my country, Poland.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]

I'm not entirely sure what you're referring to - can you elaborate? How have the EU gone with UK and US interests rather than their own?

by bpye 4y ago

I'm not entirely sure what you're referring to - can you elaborate? How have the EU gone with UK and US interests rather than their own?

kkfx 4y ago

Russian Fed. is a natural partner: - we are all European, till the Urals, we understand each others as we have done even during the cold war BETTER that what we do with the so called "anglosphere" (cfr Limes, geopolitical review), we also share similar values; - they have gazillion of natural resources we need, they are developed enough to harvest them but not enough to surpass us in tech terms, they are surrounded by not-really-friendly powers (China in primis) so we need their resources, they need our tech and support, an equal, balanced and fair partnership; Our best interest is going out of NATO, form a REAL European Union, with a common fiscal and social system, a French-lead initial nuclear deterrent toward an EU army (due to the still present language differences that makes a real general army not really doable in short time), toward again an anti-fascist Costitution modeled around Italy and Germany ones, offering Russia to apply for EAEU (EuroAsian union) with a pact of mutual and fair partnership. That's was ALREADY ongoing and that's why USA and UK have crafted Ukrainian coup n. 1 (orange revolution https://doi.org/10.1111/j.1467-856x.2008.00343.x https://doi.org/10.1111/j.1467-856x.2008.00343.x for instance) the n. 2 (Euromaidan massacres [1]) and have keeping forging nazis in the east, if you do not know just read OFFICIAL docs like: https://www.osce.org/files/f/documents/e/7/233896.pdf https://www.osce.org/files/f/documents/e/7/233896.pdf or famous think tanks from USA like: https://www.rand.org/pubs/research_briefs/RB10014.html https://www.rand.org/pubs/research_briefs/RB10014.html and relevant doc https://www.rand.org/content/dam/rand/pubs/research_briefs/RB10000/RB10014/RAND_RB10014.pdf https://www.rand.org/content/dam/rand/pubs/research_briefs/R... [1] start from https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-26079957 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-26079957 and https://jacobinmag.com/2022/02/maidan-protests-neo-nazis-russia-nato-crimea https://jacobinmag.com/2022/02/maidan-protests-neo-nazis-rus... observing the famous "F*ck the EU" Nuland's phrase AND who report that

postingawayonhn 4y ago
What a load of rubbish. Russia has no respect for basic human rights and democracy. Deep economic/social integration with Russia is very dangerous for western liberal democracies until Russia makes major reforms (would probably take 50+ years).
- nixarn 4y ago
  Totally agree. Russia could become a good partner if they'd have a working democracy, freedom of press, freedom of speech. And that the wealth in russia isn't divided so that 500 ppl own 98%+.
- c0nducktr 4y ago
  > Russia has no respect for basic human rights and democracy. Deep economic/social integration with Russia is very dangerous for western liberal democracies until Russia makes major reforms Is it? We have deep ties with Saudi Arabia. Should those be severed too?
  - throwaway5371 4y ago
    yes
    - c0nducktr 4y ago
      I appriciate your answer, but I was really looking for a response from postingawayonhn.
  - postingawayonhn 4y ago
    Absolutely. The west is only friendly with them to keep oil prices stable and to stop another middle eastern war.
- kkfx 4y ago
  [flagged]
  - 4y ago
Isinlor 4y ago
As a Pole I really do not want to relay on EU members only in helping us defend against Russians. USA and UK have proven to be a lot better partners for Ukraine than France or Germany. 5000 helmets from Germany with a month of delay were really more of an insult than help to Ukraine. France is still going around with "do not humiliate Putin". Well, I want to see him on a trial in Hague. And the idea that Poland will grant Putin any say over our politics is ridiculous.
- stackbutterflow 4y ago
  The US obviously but what did the UK did better than France and Germany? The UK really is benefiting from sharing the language of the US.
  - Isinlor 4y ago
    UK trained 22 000 Ukrainian army personnel starting from 2015. If I recall correctly they also delivered 2000 NLAWs before the start of the war. Ukrainian soldiers love NLAWs.
- sam_lowry_ 4y ago
  Germany actually supplies a lot of arms, compared to partners, they announced yesterday that they train Ukrainians to use modern howitzers before sending them to Ukraine. OTOH, their PR is shit.
  - Isinlor 4y ago
    Germans were hoping that Ukraine will fall and they can go on doing business with Russia. Right after 2014 annexation of Crimea they decided to build Nord Stream 2. And they were laughing when USA, Poland, Baltics and Ukraine were telling them that they need to diversify. It's quite possible that without German appeasement of Putin this 2022 invasion would have not even happen. France and Germany blocked Ukraine NATO membership. Some of German leaders still hope to go to business like usual like Volkswagen CEO. Germans still keep on saying that nobody could have foreseen this war. Well, in 2008, 14 years ago, Polish president in Tbilisi during the Russian invasion of Georgia: > We know very well. Today Georgia, tomorrow Ukraine, the day after tomorrow – the Baltic States and later, perhaps, time will come for my country, Poland.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]